Amtrak's Desert Wind May Return

[nshvlcat]

Interesting article about a possible return of the Desert Wind between Los Angeles and Las Vegas.

 

[me_little_me]

Probably just the possible return of more studies.

 

[the_traveler]

I like the comment that "UP (is) bad" and "BNSF is one of the best"! I just have one word HI-LINE!

And I'd love to see a train going 70 mph to make the 8 hour trip in 5 hours, especially going up the Cajon Pass and the grade out of Daggett!

 

[Provo]

I agree. It is quite possible that this is probably just the possible return of more studies to look into the possible return of more studies of a partial return of the Desert Wind.

I should have been a consultant so I could get PAID big bucks to say "BRAKE the WIND."

Consultants must have one heck of a lobby.

That reminds me of a joke about a eunuch consulting about... Well, you get the idea...

 

[Anderson]

Something in the vein of Desert Xpress/Xpress West seems more likely (there's a suspended federal loan application out there if certain things get in order, and the general principle of a more-or-less dedicated ROW, even if you just used a bunch of EMD-125s or whatever AAF ends up using so you don't have to futz with lots of electrification) than simply running stuff on the existing tracks. I'd need to look more closely at the map, but I have to wonder about the viability of a "fast conventional" service along the previously-proposed route (that could be electrified if/when CAHSR actually happens).

 

[DryCreek]

Hah! I now have a use for those old heritage baggage cars! Mobile casinos.

It was my idea first. I'm gonna' copyright it tomorrow.

Casino Train?

Oh wait. Looks like someone else beat me to that idea. X-Train

 

[dlagrua]

The only way I can see old passenger routes restored to service is if private industry steps in. The political climate in Washington has caused Amtrak to shrink the system not expand it. Desert Wind, Broadway Ltd, National Ltd, Floridian and numerous other routes were eliminated by Amtrak. There has been TALK about restoring the Sunset Ltd service east, the Desert Wind, and the Floridian. Some of this was mentioned in Amtrak's long term plans. None of it has happened and is very unlikely to happen.

My suggestion is for Amtrak try occasional excursion trains on these routes and see how the public responds.

 

[jis]

AAF is using Siemens Chargers.

 

[Paulus]

I sincerely doubt Nevada will find it.

 

[TinCan782]

Yea, right! Look how successful X-Train was!

 

[StriderGDM]

Yeah, sounds like talk about another study to someday perhaps consider proposing bringing this back.

I wouldn't hold my breath. (I was almost going to say 'bet on it' but that's a cheap response ;-)

 

[seat38a]

Only way it will happen is if California subsidizes it as part of Amtrak California. And its going to have to happen as a corridor service and NOT a LD train to Salt Lake. Most likely 2 or three round trip to start.

 

[railiner]

My suggestion is for Amtrak try occasional excursion trains on these routes and see how the public responds.

While your suggestion could possibly have some merit....I am not sure if the response to an occasional 'excursion' on some route, even if highly successful, is a reliable means of determining whether a regular operation will echo that result....

 

[Anderson]

My suggestion is for Amtrak try occasional excursion trains on these routes and see how the public responds.

While your suggestion could possibly have some merit....I am not sure if the response to an occasional 'excursion' on some route, even if highly successful, is a reliable means of determining whether a regular operation will echo that result....

Agreed, but a set of excursions would give a basis upon which to build a case for the service. Witness how Iowa Pacific has worked in this respect with both Oklahoma City-Tulsa and, rumor has it, Chicago-Madison.

 

[cirdan]

My suggestion is for Amtrak try occasional excursion trains on these routes and see how the public responds.

While your suggestion could possibly have some merit....I am not sure if the response to an occasional 'excursion' on some route, even if highly successful, is a reliable means of determining whether a regular operation will echo that result....

Sometimes an excursion train can also have the effect of channeling public awareness and interest.

So suppose an Excursion train runs maybe half a dozen times a year. Some hotels in Vegas may be picking up that their passengers are coming by train, either by surveying the customers directly or because of block bookings by rail travel agencies. Then a bit after that there may be a discussion about the need of having a train and those hotels may say, sure, trains bring us business. Without those excursion trains, the same hotels may not even have realized trains existed or had any relevance to their business and would have laughed at the suggestion that Vegas might need any.

 

[andersone]

Brother In Law By Marriage #2 was a Master Sergeant in the Army

He used to say

"If you don't have a plan, you have to plan to have a plant"

the other day in another thread I mention Mr. Flagler

wouldn't it be nice if someone had a variation on his theme and decided to fund this project?

but as Mother said

"If wishes were horses then beggars would ride"

 

[Palmetto]

Only way it will happen is if California subsidizes it as part of Amtrak California. And its going to have to happen as a corridor service and NOT a LD train to Salt Lake. Most likely 2 or three round trip to start.

Not quite. We've already been down this road, and back then the UP required that double-track be put down on Cima Hill to accomodate the train. After a few studies--of course--the desert tortoise put a stop to the whole thing, IIRC.

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

Look for the Desert Wind to be restored the same time the Heartland Flyer gets extended into Kansas

 

[VentureForth]

And after the Sunset Limited. The only thing being resurrected is the "wind" part of it.

 

[Eric S]

Not sure California would be too interested in funding a LA-LV corridor; perhaps in conjunction with Nevada, but I doubt CA alone would fund this.

 

[jis]

Only way it will happen is if California subsidizes it as part of Amtrak California. And its going to have to happen as a corridor service and NOT a LD train to Salt Lake. Most likely 2 or three round trip to start.

As I have said before, I will fall off my chair in utter astonishment if California steps up to fund this. They have many other bigger fish to fry that as things stand are under-funded.

 

[TiBike]

As I have said before, I will fall off my chair in utter astonishment if California steps up to fund this. They have many other bigger fish to fry that as things stand are under-funded.

They'll start studying it as soon as they're done studying extending the Capitol Corridor to Salinas. They've been at it about 15 years, and should be done in another 10 or 12. :wacko:

 

[Paulus]

As I have said before, I will fall off my chair in utter astonishment if California steps up to fund this. They have many other bigger fish to fry that as things stand are under-funded.

They'll start studying it as soon as they're done studying extending the Capitol Corridor to Salinas. They've been at it about 15 years, and should be done in another 10 or 12. :wacko:

Someone's an optimist. They've been studying LA to Coachella for more than thirty years with another study currently in progress.

 

[afigg]

Someone's an optimist. They've been studying LA to Coachella for more than thirty years with another study currently in progress.

Yes, service to Coachella valley and Palm Springs has been stuck in a repeated feasibility study phase for many years (do a study, rinse, repeat). However, the FRA recently awarded $2.9 million to California towards a full up Service Development Plan and EIS for the corridor. There is also a website for the Coachella Valley corridor service studies. There is real progress being made towards starting corridor service from LA to Coachella Valley. That said, revenue service won't happen any time soon, because of just how bleeping slow the Alternative Analysis and EIS process has become. The fact sheet for the corridor study lays out a 7 year long schedule with the Alternative Analysis, SDP/Tier I EIS, and FEIS & PE phases taking a mind numbing 5 years to complete. This for an active freight train corridor which already has passenger service.
This is the reality facing Nevada or Las Vegas if they wanted to fund a start-up LA to Las Vegas service. Even with decent previous LA-Vegas [non-HSR] corridor service studies, the feds would require a SDP and Tier I EIS at a minimum before the state or city could get any significant federal funding for starting even a once a day service.

 

[dlagrua]

Getting back to my original idea about Amtrak doing excursion trains on some of the old routes, I must agree with Anderson that they would provide a basis to build a case for the service.

Say if Amtrak offered an excursion on the recently restored PRR Broadway limited tracks. They could start selling tickets months in advance, fill up the train to where the revenue would justify the run, and run the excursion on the route . The publicity, exposure and the public perception may end up being very positive for passenger rail and may lead to some good things. Towns that have not seen a passenger train pass through them in years might realize the benefit and advantages of passenger rail service. If you generate the demand then that may be translated into action. .