Amtrak's Pioneer

[jis]

Both the routes of 25/26 and 35/36 require renegotiating access charges with UP, and you know how that can go....

Also UP will need to put back a crossover providing access to the Steel Bridge from the Columbia Gorge line which they have apparently removed. This will be necessary for a restored Pioneer to get to Portland Union Station.

 

[WoodyinNYC]

A revived Pioneer (and Desert Wind) as an extension or split heading west from Denver would surely work better if the Zephyr's segment Chicago-Denver worked better.

Well, what do you know. Folks working on the Midwest Rail initiatives had worked out a plan to have many trains Chicago-Quad Cities, some to Iowa City, some of those going on to Des Moines, and a handful to Omaha -- with one more daily train, a second frequency to the Zephyr, to Denver. The rerouted and twinned Zephyr would pass thru three metro areas, compared to the current route thru the cornfields, to pick up more passengers. The upgraded route would shave a little time off the run. And of course, a second frequency all by itself always increases the passenger totals.

That plan, phase 1, will reach the Quad Cities in a few more years. But alas, it stalled out in Iowa. Without another huge input of federal funds, it ain't going nowhere.

 

[Karl1459]

I had an opportunity to ride PDX-Odgen a few months before the Pioneer was discontinued. By that time it went east from Odgen across Wyoming to Borie, then hooked up with the CZ at Denver. It was run only 3 or 4 days a week. The crew on board were up to speed with the reasoning that the equipment would go to a daily Empire Builder (then 4 day/week).

As much as I would like to see it come back Amtrak (and congress) need to focus on getting enough long distance equipment to keep trains reliable and able to exploit peak ridership.

If equipment becomes available then a (SEA-PDX) - SLC - Las Vegas NV - LAX train should be considered.

 

[grahamru]

The Pioneer--like the Portland Rose and the City of Portland of Union Pacific fame--was an important part of Eastern Oregon, especially in harsh winters in the Columbia Gorge and snow on the Blue Mountains. When I-84 was blocked, the Pioneer often went through. Many times, I-84 would have severe issues over Deadman Pass and I distinctly remember many horrible winters in the Blues. Amtrak was a sure thing. I remember riding the Pioneer when it had Amfleet and I remember the transition to the Superliner era as well. My family used to ride about every other weekend between The Dalles (THD) and La Grande (LAE) from 1978 until 1986. Going through the windswept Columbia and through the rugged Blues was a treat that I will never forget. My grandparents lived in La Grande and later Meacham, and I have many found memories of this train and many points along the route. I even remember those horrible AmHuts in Hood River, The Dalles, Hinkle, and Pendleton. The station in La Grande was/is a beautiful.

How long did the Pioneer operate through Cheyenne? 25/26 ran through Cheyenne and Denver in 1982, but I don't remember when that stopped (pre-1986 I believe).

Other memories, does anyone else remember riding NRHS/Amtrak excursions down the Deschutes (early to mid-1980s)? The NRHS excursions ran from Portland to Wishram, then down the Oregon Trunk (Bend Branch for those UP fans) to Bend (overnight), and then Bend to Chemult and then over the Cascades back to Portland. This excursion had all Superliners. Also, does anyone else remember riding the Mount Rainier (Trains 796/797)?

 

[jis]

Grahamru, you can use the handy-dandy Museum of Railway Timetable Library to research answers to your questions regarding Amtrak's Pioneer. This library contains a copy of all Amtrak timetables that have ever been issued.

 

[John Baier]

Hi,

I have been to 39 states and 5 Canadian provinces by train. One family circle trip went CHI to SLC to LVS (Desert Wind) to LAX to FLG for the Grand Canyon back to CHI. A second trip occur in conjunction with the Vancouver Expo (I believe in 1986). This trip went as follows with stops at each place: CHI to DEN to SLC to PDX (Pioneer) to SEA to Vancouver Island by hydroplane to Vancouver by ferry. Then on the Canadian (CP route) from VAC via Lake Louise to WINnepeg then by bus to GFK and finally back to CHI. Great trips. Wife and daughter remember them fondly. About ready to start over with a new generation.

John Baier

 

[neroden]

That plan, phase 1, will reach the Quad Cities in a few more years.

Well, here's hoping that the Moline service will make enough Iowans jealous that they'll start voting for service themselves. Politically, support seems to be very strong in the Quad Cities and Iowa City, and clearly significant in Cedar Rapids and Dubuque, but Des Moines and Council Bluffs don't seem to know what they're missing.

Iowa is pretty rural, but (like everywhere else) it's been urbanizing. And the population is concentrating in the string of cities along the Iowa Interstate (former Rock Island) line. Iowa also tends to have its young adults leave the state; this is counteracted by high birth rates and immigration from outside the US. This is bound to change the demographics of Iowa, fairly quickly, though I'm not sure exactly how.

There's a demographic political issue in Iowa, in that two of the largest metropolitan areas cross borders (Omaha/Council Bluffs and the Quad Cities). (Many states have similar issues.) This means that support from Moline or Omaha for passenger rail doesn't count for much in getting Iowa Legislature support.

I think demographics are actually more favorable to passenger rail in Nebraska, where Lincoln plus the Nebraska part of the Omaha metro area are 58% of the state population. Nebraska isn't going to spend money in Iowa if Iowa doesn't. However, I wonder if the political fates might align to allow for an Omaha-Denver day train before they will allow for the reconstruction of the Iowa Interstate route. This will probably be sometime after the fight for a walkable Omaha with decent local transit is won, and that fight seems to be quite active right now.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

I have ridden all three routes. It was fascinating to ride through the Rockies with at least 18 superliner cars.

 

[NE933]

CHamilton's group: Godspeed. Bring it, and the Desert Wind, back. I want to ride what all say are breathtaking routes that the communities relied on.