Dealing with Passengers Unhappy with Community Dining

[reving19]

I love riding Amtrak and meeting interesting people. However, on a recent trip I ran into a person unhappy with community dining. I came into the dining car for lunch, the rail car attendant sat me down at a table with 3 people. There were empty tables around. I said "how are you" to everyone and one guy says to the attendant "There are other empty tables around, why do you sit more people here?" The attendant explained that the tables will fill up soon. He guaranteed it. But he finally asked me if I wanted to sit at an empty table and I said Yes. I ended up sitting with a couple of cool guys heading to a concert.

So, who was wrong here? The guy for complaining about more people being at the table or the attendant for sitting me at a crowded table when there were empty tables around? Maybe neither one?

I didn't ask originally to be sat at an empty table because meeting people is one of the appeals of Amtrak. But while I am sure some of you are going to see the guy's side of it. However, I don't like someone talking about me to someone else like I'm not there. Everybody else I have met at in the dining car has been memorable in a good way. This guy, not so much.

Ever had this problem for a passenger and/or employee point of view?

 

[Shawn Ryu]

If the guy didnt want to eat with others he could have ordered his lunch to go. He could have taken his meal back to his seat or get it to his room.

And I am pretty sure the attendant tells the passengers that they will be sharing the table with others if they are gonna dine at the dining car.

 

[George B]

I do not like the idea of community seating at all, but it is obviously necessary for Amtrak to do it this way. Nobody was wrong here. But, people such as me who do not want to have conversations should be respectful and polite in telling people we are not much of a talker. The ideal situation would be to put you at another table so you could enjoy some conversation with people who do want to talk. But, in the end, the burden is on me (the non-talker) to not ruin it for everybody else since community dining is the rule. Because of the close seating, it is impossible to just ignore everybody at your table and read or stare out the window without appearing rude.

My simple solution is that I do not eat in the Diner very much. I will either forgo the meal (Amtrak feeds you plenty so that you can skip a meal), go to the Lounge Car, ask for my meal in my room, or wait until last call when there are open tables.

 

[Anderson]

I've always liked it; I (almost) always get to chat with people. I can possibly understand if people don't want to share a seat and it's a party of 3 (or the company is particularly cold), but as far as I know, shared tables have been more or less a part of the dining car situation for over a century. Then again, I'm at one of those tables an average of once every two weeks (note that this is skewed by my LD trips), so...

 

[Ryan]

So, who was wrong here? The guy for complaining about more people being at the table?

Yes. That's how it works in the diner.
I've never had any issues with it - sometimes we end up in a great conversation, sometimes we hardly acknowledge each other's presence. I'm cool either way.

 

[Guest]

I don't have a problem with community dining, but if you have to sit next to a stranger instead of across from them I can see how that can invade some people's personal space. The booths are not that big and much smaller than coach seats. I think if there is three in a group let them have their own table. I think some Amtrak workers try to overmanage space sometimes by cramming people in as tight as possible from the beginning and it makes you feel more like cattle and less like a customer. Coach attendants can be bad about this too.

 

[Eric308]

So, who was wrong here? The guy for complaining about more people being at the table?

Yes. That's how it works in the diner.
I've never had any issues with it - sometimes we end up in a great conversation, sometimes we hardly acknowledge each other's presence. I'm cool either way.

Man...if you are that anti-social find another means of transportation. I've never had an uncomfortable experience and look forward to meeting other people. I've even had people request to sit with me again and vice versa.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

IMHO, many people have a "restaurant mentality" when it comes to a table. That the entire table is theirs, even if they are alone.

Community seating is the same way on cruise ships. They assign or seat as many people to a table, as the table can hold. As on a train, I find it makes for meeting new people, and usually some good conversation.

I have cruised several times, but two incidences happened on my last cruise that seem to fit the discussion here.

At lunch time, as in a train's dining car, they full up each table, one at a time. This one couple was VERY unhappy to be shown to a table already occupied by others (including me). They "stormed" out of the dining room in a great huff, feeling that they were wronged, and quite angry at the hostess.

At dinner time, you have an assigned table; same table for the entire cruise. On our third night, our table-mates showed up with some friends they made, and were quite insistent that we leave their table so that their friends could sit with them. Well, it is not "their table" (even if their first cruise, they should have figured this out by the third night). It is our table, and the one table we were also assigned to eat at. The waiter attempted to explain it to them, but they too left in a great huff, feeling that they were wronged.

 

[Ryan]

So, who was wrong here? The guy for complaining about more people being at the table?

Yes. That's how it works in the diner.
I've never had any issues with it - sometimes we end up in a great conversation, sometimes we hardly acknowledge each other's presence. I'm cool either way.

Man...if you are that anti-social find another means of transportation. I've never had an uncomfortable experience and look forward to meeting other people. I've even had people request to sit with me again and vice versa.

What in my post led you to believe that I'm in any way antisocial?

 

[VentureForth]

...but as far as I know, shared tables have been more or less a part of the dining car situation for over a century.

As much as I have enjoyed community dining on all of my LD trips, unfortunately the passengers are not necessarily aware - or care - that this is the way it's been done for over a century.

As mentioned in other threads, our community, our traditions, our culture is shifting drastically. When the culture around us changes, it's hard to fit it into that little box called "the way we've always done it".

Quite frankly, I'm suprised (pleasantly) that so many of the tradtional onboard services exist they way they still do. I miss a lot, though (like movies in the lounge), but things progress.

The dining room, though, cannot change their community seating policy without drastic changes overall that I'm not even sure what would be. I'm glad that the LSA was polite during this transaction. Not all LSAs would have been. It was a win win for everyone, but three Amtrak passengers need to understand how things work and learn to avoid or cope.

 

[Shanghai]

I have had only one experience where one of the people at our table didn't want to chat

with the rest of us. After two attempts to bring him into the table conversation, we

stopped trying. He ate his dinner and left. The rest of us had nice conversation.

To each his own!!

On a cruise, if we don't like the other people at the dinner table, we switch after

the first night. I would never think to ask any others to leave the table for our

friends. That's really bold and rather low class.

 

[me_little_me]

I think everyone has missed the boat here. Three people at a table constitutes a pretty full table and if the car was mostly empty, it probably seemed silly to the passenger that someone would be crowded in with them in that circumstance. I also probably would have questioned it even though we love sitting with others. Two strangers can communicate easily as can three. A couple and a stranger can also do well. However, three together would more likely talk about their own things rather than communicate with a fourth stranger which could end up being awkward for all. Being the odd person out in a group forced together is not fun. Similarly, a group has a common interest which they might want to discuss leaving them having to fit in the fourth to their conversation.

Once the attendant stated that a full car was expected, an experienced rider would probably have accepted that but an inexperienced one would probably be skeptical. The attendant did the right thing by offering another table but that does not mean that he diner was wrong.It may not have been the community dining but the unnecessary crowding that the patron was against.

As an aside, we love community dining. On our cruise we chose the "dine anytime" option but specifically stated each time that we welcomed others sitting with us. And a few times in restaurants when it was crowded with a wait for tables, we have mentioned to others behind us that we could sit together and they would thus be seated quicker. We have never been disappointed on train dining except when nobody has been seated with us.

 

[fredandgingermad]

i've found that community dining is one of the nicer parts of eating in the dining car on Amtrak, i've met some really interesting people

 

[rrdude]

I agree with all on the "benefits" of community dining while traveling via rail. With ONE EXCEPTION, those damned CCC cars with the sideways-facing tables.

I am of the opinion that you CANNOT fit four adults comfortably at these tables. I have refused to be added as a fourth there, while explaining profusely to the seated occupants that it had nothing to do with them.....

In fact, one time I opted to wait for a "regular 4-top" was on the CAP, on the way back from the last Gathering in St. Louie.

Call me anti-social, but I personally HATE those tables, unless it's only for two, (ok, maybe three) and it's NOT used for dining. (cocktails or snack)

 

[lyke99]

My wife and I like the community seating. When my wife was going to take her first long distance trip, I let her know beforehand and she was ready for it - no problem. Maybe that was the nature of the issue in the original post, the people already seated weren't mentally ready to share a table.

Frankly, after a number of trips on the Empire Builder where we've been unable to get dinner in the diner sometimes if riding coach between Chicago and Minnesota, we were surprised on a Lake Shore Limited trip to see the dining car crew allow each group (and even a few single patrons) to have their own table.

 

[Bob Dylan]

I agree about the CCC Mafia seat! Ive met some really cool people on Trains,especially in Diners and the Lounge where community seating is the norm! Of course on the PPC :wub: couples can have their own table even if the seating is a little cramped! Personally I don't care to ride "backwards" while Traveling so try to get a forward facing seat by a window if possible!

IMO the most important thing is the attitude of the LSA, some are cool, some a Marionettes and some are Booth Lizards and let the Waiters do all the work including seating!! Ive known single people that Travel that ask the LSA to seat them whenever possible with amiable people, others are loners and even soreheads who probably should eat in their room or seat or downstairs in the cafe car! The last catagory is the traveler (no names to protect the guilty!) who has his own chef and penthouse suite where he can dine alone or with invited peasants! :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[the_traveler]

I think everyone has missed the boat here. Three people at a table constitutes a pretty full table and if the car was mostly empty, it probably seemed silly to the passenger that someone would be crowded in with them in that circumstance.

During dinner, if they have sittings for (say) 5:30 and 6 PM, when you come at 5:30, you will see many tables not being used. However, after all the 6 PM reservations come, ALL the tables will be full.

So are you saying that if you're the last one seated at 5:30 with a party of 3, you should be seated at your own table?

And then when the 6 PM people come, they'll have to turn 4 away, because all the tables are full?

 

[TVRM610]

I agree with all on the "benefits" of community dining while traveling via rail. With ONE EXCEPTION, those damned CCC cars with the sideways-facing tables.

I am of the opinion that you CANNOT fit four adults comfortably at these tables. I have refused to be added as a fourth there, while explaining profusely to the seated occupants that it had nothing to do with them.....

In fact, one time I opted to wait for a "regular 4-top" was on the CAP, on the way back from the last Gathering in St. Louie.

Call me anti-social, but I personally HATE those tables, unless it's only for two, (ok, maybe three) and it's NOT used for dining. (cocktails or snack)

I have eaten at the CCC sideways tables as part of a group of 3, there was PLENTY of room for three. I agree that 4 would be too crowded, but I think 4 is too crowded in the regular booths too, CCC and standard diners. But I understand why it is necessary and I take what I get. I just really really hope for a window seat.

 

[transit54]

I've always been a big fan of community seating in the diners. It's probably my favorite aspect of LD train travel, second to the SSLs. But for me, LD train travel is a very social experience, and that's one of the many reasons I like it. I always sit in the SSLs and strike up conversations with fellow passengers - I've met many interesting people this way from all over the world. I can understand that not everyone enjoys this, but there are alternatives, like taking your meal in your room.

 

[arrow3]

I actually liked those CCC sideways facing tables. I traveled with two other people last year and was always seated in one of those tables (just the three of us). There was ample room for us, but not for a fourth person.

Regarding community seating - I'll be honest, I don't like it. Even towards the end of lunch or dinner when it's not too crowded, they'll still sit you with others when there are many empty tables around. I will admit that on my recent cross-country trip, I did eat with interesting people and enjoyed all of those meals. However, I was also seated by myself several times and enjoyed that as well.

I don't mind as much when they sit 4 singles together, but anything else can be awkard (especially for the single person) - I don't like that at all.

As someone else mentioned, getting food to go is a good option.

Is community seating the norm on the European trains with dining cars do as well?

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

I think everyone has missed the boat here. Three people at a table constitutes a pretty full table and if the car was mostly empty, it probably seemed silly to the passenger that someone would be crowded in with them in that circumstance.

Well, a pretty full table is not a completely full table.

On the train (as on a cruise ship), they completely fill one table before starting on the next table. Yea, on a cruise ship packing everyone into one table, while there are 100's of still empty tables, might seem odd (but it isn't).

IMHO, the reason is that you want everyone at a specific table to be at the same stage of eating/ordering. Because of this, you can't easily come back later and add one or two more people to a table that is pretty full, when those people already seated have moved onto eating their main entree. In other words, you pack the table to full, and then everyone orders and eats at the same time. You then pack the second table to full, and those people order while the people at the first table are on their salads. And so on.

 

[VentureForth]

Back to the OP, there can be situations where a party of three would be a bit more uncomfortable sharing with a single individual than either two couples, a couple plus two singles or 4 singles.

 

[had8ley]

I think everyone has missed the boat here. Three people at a table constitutes a pretty full table and if the car was mostly empty, it probably seemed silly to the passenger that someone would be crowded in with them in that circumstance. I also probably would have questioned it even though we love sitting with others. Two strangers can communicate easily as can three. A couple and a stranger can also do well. However, three together would more likely talk about their own things rather than communicate with a fourth stranger which could end up being awkward for all. Being the odd person out in a group forced together is not fun. Similarly, a group has a common interest which they might want to discuss leaving them having to fit in the fourth to their conversation.

Once the attendant stated that a full car was expected, an experienced rider would probably have accepted that but an inexperienced one would probably be skeptical. The attendant did the right thing by offering another table but that does not mean that he diner was wrong.It may not have been the community dining but the unnecessary crowding that the patron was against.

As an aside, we love community dining. On our cruise we chose the "dine anytime" option but specifically stated each time that we welcomed others sitting with us. And a few times in restaurants when it was crowded with a wait for tables, we have mentioned to others behind us that we could sit together and they would thus be seated quicker. We have never been disappointed on train dining except when nobody has been seated with us.

I agree with your post. I've only had to leave a table once and that was because a rather tipsy pax spilled a split of wine on me. Nice way to meet different, and sometimes strange, people. But what the heck; you only go round once and you might meet someone you'll enjoy. From the OBS side~ seating one pax at a table is another set up they have to re-do.

 

[chandj]

Spouse and I have traveled for three years with a small child on LD trains and we have never had a fourth person seated with us at any meal in any dining car. I'm pretty sure this is for the happiness of the potential fourth person, as most adults can be forgiven for not wanting to sit at table with a small child if they don't know anything about the child's manners (or lack there of). To the OP, though, I wish the already-seated passenger in the case you describe had handled the situation without making you feel unwelcome.

I am not a fan of community dining, but my spouse is--to each their own.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I said "how are you" to everyone and one guy says to the attendant "There are other empty tables around, why do you sit more people here?" ... So, who was wrong here? The guy for complaining about more people being at the table or the attendant for sitting me at a crowded table when there were empty tables around? Maybe neither one?

The attendant was simply following the standard protocol so there's nothing to blame them for. You were simply following the lead of the attendant so there's nothing to blame you for. From my perspective it sounds like it was the arrogant prick who acted like you weren't there who was in the wrong. If he wanted a private experience for him and his buddies he should have had his meals delivered to his room or rented a private car or simply spoken up as they were being seated. Occasionally I'll run into a real nutcase or one of those xenophobic prejudiced types but most of the time I enjoy the communal seating. Heck, sometimes the really weird folks are the most interesting to converse with.