had8ley
Engineer
If #91 and 97 are on time into Miami is dinner offered in the diner ?
Dinner on #91 & 97
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It's been a year or so since I've been down to MIA on either of those, but I don't think so. As I recall, I think they completely stop food service, and I think they even shut down the snack/lounge service, when they arrive at West Palm Beach, which is the northernmost station stop on the Florida southeast coast. If they were sufficiently late that they could begin meal service in Winter Haven, they probably would do that, but south of there would be iffy, I'd think. And (again, as I recall) they don't open anything up on 92 or 98 until they have passed West Palm Beach outbound unless they are running significantly late. Our engine on 98 blew it's rectifier stack at about Boynton Beach one time, putting us into a siding for several hours, and they did open up all food service that time. Remember that on 91/97 they only drop off passengers from West Palm Beach south - they do not pick up any passengers. That means if they don't have any passengers to drop off at a particular station, they don't even stop there. As a result, they frequently pick up a lot of time inbound in that corridor, and they want all the food service buttoned up, cleaned up, with trash collected and bagged, etc., when they hit MIA. Outbound, they only pick up passengers in that corridor - they do not drop any off.
battalion51
Engineer
They will not serve dinner on Silver Service unless the service can pretty much be concluded by the time the train hits Sebring. The time is needed from Sebring down to Miami to clean everything up, pack up the dishes and linens, do the accounting procedures, etc. So even though there is no meal service, the crew is still hard at work til the train hits the bumper in Miami.
What dishes and linens? :unsure: :blink: There are no dishes and linens anymore, unless you're on the Auto Train or the Empire Builder.
I recently completed travel on #91 and 92, twice Dec 2006.
On #91, we met a retired couple enroute to MIA from NYP.
I was getting out at LAK (which is lunchtime 11:40AM) and recalled the conversation
with them having ' a few more hrs to get to Miami and needing get something now from the Lounge car'.
We were all in coach on this trip.
Charlie Cacioppo
On #91, we met a retired couple enroute to MIA from NYP.
I was getting out at LAK (which is lunchtime 11:40AM) and recalled the conversation
with them having ' a few more hrs to get to Miami and needing get something now from the Lounge car'.
We were all in coach on this trip.
Charlie Cacioppo
had8ley
Engineer
Last trip I took into Miami there was a wye and no bumper. The crew "lounged" in the lounge from Winter Park south. Quite a bit of a break in my book.
Windy City LSA
Service Attendant
Usually when I see one of your posts, it's almost guaranteed to be something negative about the diner or lounge staff.
I don't know how far it is from Winter Park to Miami. But I can assure you that there is plenty of work to be done before arriving at the final destination. Speaking for myself, I was never done with my paperwork when I detrained and often stayed a bit at the station to wrap it up. When you see staff "lounging" maybe they finished their work early. Some work more quickly and efficiently than others. Maybe they're lazy bums. Only they know. In a perfect world, the diner and lounge would be open to the bumper, wye, whatever. The choice to close "early" is not that of the crew, but that of Amtrak. I was once borderline yelled at by a yardmaster or some jerk in charge because I did not have my Cafe closed and ready of off-load the instant we arrived at CUS. They needed to get the train out of the staion ASAP, and I was holding up the whole process. This was in part due to last minute passengers desperately needing a can of soda or bag of chips before arrival. Granted, not ALL trains are in such a rush to get out of there. Many even stay. Another time as we were nearing CUS, I was behind and desperately trying to do my accouting. It was crazy...suddenly a steady stream of sleeper passengers one by one kept coming into the diner asking me to break larger bills so they may have tips for their attendant. Then of course half of them want to stay and chit-chat, which I'd love to do if I didn't have work to finish. Just because something is closed doesn't mean it's over.
I guess my point is, you have no idea what is involved with that job and how difficult it can be until you have done it. There is no comparison to he train and say your local restaurant or conveinent store. Do some crews on some trains occasionally close a bit earlier than they're supposed to??? Probably. Do some crews stay open later or serve an extra meal because the train is late? Yep. There are reasons for foodservice cars (LD, anyway) to close "early". It's not a matter of laziness. It's a matter of necessity. Believe me. I would not fib. Some patience and understanding and a little less judgement passing are good things.
Since we always start and end our trips at WPK, and most of them start on 91 or 97 southbound, I can say with conviction that the only crew we see in the lounge car, with VERY rare exceptions, when we get on the train, are the conductor and/or AC doing his/her paperwork and getting ready for the ALWAYS very busy ORL station stop, (plus the lounge attendant, at the sales counter). ORL is about the busiest station stop on that route, at least from CHS on south, since that's the farthest north we've been on Silver Service. And I can't recall there being any mass influx of OBS into the lounge car. Sometimes you will see a collection of them gathering in the Diner for awhile, but almost never in the lounge car. And once you start getting close to the end of the route, OBS can get pretty frantic getting things cleaned up, organized, buttoned up, paperwork finished, and trash gathered, etc., just as Windy City indicated.
There is no wye at MIA that I'm aware of. There is a circle track that runs around the MIA station, and they use that to turn the train around, although every time we've gone all the way to MIA they have pulled straight in to the station, "to the bumper" and then after the train is completely offloaded, backed out and then gone around the circle track to turn around. There's a wye at TPA used by 91/92 to turn around to back into the TPA station, there's a wye at JAX (used by Sunset, at least it was when Sunset ran there, to transition from the east-west segment to/from the Panhandle to the north-south segment to/from ORL, as it either backed in or backed out of the JAX station during that transition), and there's a wye south of ORL that Sunset used to turn around there to go back to SFA for overnight servicing (and vice-versa for outgoing Sunsets).
There is no wye at MIA that I'm aware of. There is a circle track that runs around the MIA station, and they use that to turn the train around, although every time we've gone all the way to MIA they have pulled straight in to the station, "to the bumper" and then after the train is completely offloaded, backed out and then gone around the circle track to turn around. There's a wye at TPA used by 91/92 to turn around to back into the TPA station, there's a wye at JAX (used by Sunset, at least it was when Sunset ran there, to transition from the east-west segment to/from the Panhandle to the north-south segment to/from ORL, as it either backed in or backed out of the JAX station during that transition), and there's a wye south of ORL that Sunset used to turn around there to go back to SFA for overnight servicing (and vice-versa for outgoing Sunsets).
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G
Guest
Guest
Pardon my ignorance, but what is a "wye"?
Don't know miles, but in hours its about 6, give or take a few minutes.
Why do you want to know? :lol: :lol:
Just kidding of course, I love to play with words.
A wye is a section of track and switches that allow one to turn a train around completely to face the other direction. Think of the letter Y, but then add a line across the top of the Y, in effect making a triangle. A train coming from the bottom of the Y or tail, could go up the left arm of the Y pulling out the track that runs across the top of the Y till it clears all switches. Then the train backs across the top of the wye until it clears the right arm of the Y. Once clear of the switch and it has been reset to lead down the right arm of the Y, the train then pulls forward down that right arm returning to the tail of the Y, but now facing the opposite direction it was originally facing.
It's 270 miles from Miami to Winter Park, assuming that one doesn't take the detour to Tampa offered by the Silver Star.
G
Guest
Guest
Sebring to Miami is close to four hours. Does it take that long to do all the nessessary things? THe train would need to be around four hours late to serve dinner. Considering that the star appears to run 2-3 hours late quite often, I would hate to wait to eat until nine, especialy with children.
In my experience with 91 and 97, they don't shut down the lounge (snack bar) until shortly before the train is due to arrive at West Palm Beach. Check with the loung attendant, and if it is late enough that you think it would be a problem, purchase whatever you think would be enough for the kids to "tide them over" until you get to Miami. And, again, from West Palm Beach south to Miami, the train usually picks up time, because it only stops to drop off passengers, and if there are no passengers for a particular station stop, it won't even stop there. And I think the double-tracking of that corridor is almost complete, so the transit time through that corridor should continue to improve. They share the corridor with Tri-Rail commuters, but the Tri-Rail stops are very short duration and they move right along.
had8ley
Engineer
Sorry about the negativity but there have been posts where I do compliment the crew. (I ate a lot of crow about being one of the first to experience SDS on the City of New Orleans.) Having spent 30 plus years drawing a railroad check (and started out working 16 hours a day, seven days a week) and having seen the "heyday" of passenger train days the crews of today have it made.(Cell phones and using revenue space for personal use was strictly taboo or unheard of) My point is this; be prepared for anything and everything. It was not so long ago that Silver Service went to pot and people were stuck on the trains for hours on end. It was brought out that the crew actually locked themselves in the baggage car. I would wish that every trip was perfect but the attitude conveyed by some crews, as evidenced by others (NOT myself) posting here, leaves much to be desired in customer service. I'm not blaming the crews as much as I am trying to light a fire under management. Perhaps you may want to write me off as another complainer but don't forget one thing my friend. I've done everything from coach cleaner to engineer and have the credentials to prove it. You say you're an LSA but don't know how far it is from Winter Park to Miami. You really berate those that pay your way. There was a time in Amtrak days (before the Southern gave it up) that you could board the Crescent, in the station in New Orleans, and get hot cereal and hot freshly baked muffins and croissants BEFORE leaving the station. Now one is lucky if the diner is open pulling out of Slidell (about an hour out of New Orleans.) Sounds like you're trying to blame the yardmaster, the sleeping car passengers and me or anybody who happens to come along !!!Usually when I see one of your posts, it's almost guaranteed to be something negative about the diner or lounge staff.
I don't know how far it is from Winter Park to Miami. But I can assure you that there is plenty of work to be done before arriving at the final destination. Speaking for myself, I was never done with my paperwork when I detrained and often stayed a bit at the station to wrap it up. When you see staff "lounging" maybe they finished their work early. Some work more quickly and efficiently than others. Maybe they're lazy bums. Only they know. In a perfect world, the diner and lounge would be open to the bumper, wye, whatever. The choice to close "early" is not that of the crew, but that of Amtrak. I was once borderline yelled at by a yardmaster or some jerk in charge because I did not have my Cafe closed and ready of off-load the instant we arrived at CUS. They needed to get the train out of the staion ASAP, and I was holding up the whole process. This was in part due to last minute passengers desperately needing a can of soda or bag of chips before arrival. Granted, not ALL trains are in such a rush to get out of there. Many even stay. Another time as we were nearing CUS, I was behind and desperately trying to do my accouting. It was crazy...suddenly a steady stream of sleeper passengers one by one kept coming into the diner asking me to break larger bills so they may have tips for their attendant. Then of course half of them want to stay and chit-chat, which I'd love to do if I didn't have work to finish. Just because something is closed doesn't mean it's over.
I guess my point is, you have no idea what is involved with that job and how difficult it can be until you have done it. There is no comparison to he train and say your local restaurant or conveinent store. Do some crews on some trains occasionally close a bit earlier than they're supposed to??? Probably. Do some crews stay open later or serve an extra meal because the train is late? Yep. There are reasons for foodservice cars (LD, anyway) to close "early". It's not a matter of laziness. It's a matter of necessity. Believe me. I would not fib. Some patience and understanding and a little less judgement passing are good things.
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National Limited
Service Attendant
I'm booked on 98 leaving Miami in early March. Am I to understand that this train leaves Miami at 7 in the morning and the dining car does not open until it reaches West Palm Beach at 9? I sure hope I've read the previous posts incorrectly!
had8ley
Engineer
I agree...
had8ley
Engineer
I stand corrected about the existence of a wye in Miami.
National Limited
Service Attendant
I'm booked on 98 leaving Miami in early March. Am I to understand that this train leaves Miami at 7 something in the morning and the dining car does not open for breakvast until it reaches West Palm Beach at 9? I sure hope I've read the previous posts incorrectly!
I spoke to a ticket agent at Amtrak Miami, and she thinks they do open the diner for breakfast now before the train gets to West Palm Beach, although she's not sure exactly when they would open it. She said the crew boards the train before the train starts to board passengers (she actually said they board it in the yard before it's backed into the station for boarding), to open things up and to get set up, and that it would begin serving before West Palm. So while I still can't say exactly when it would happen, it does sound like you would be able to get breakfast. That's a change from the last time we took 98 out of Miami.
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battalion51
Engineer
With the advent of SDS, Diner-Lite, whatever the heck it is, it makes set up times a lot shorter, and prep times a lot shorter. This allows the crew to get the car open a lot faster.
National Limited
Service Attendant
Well, I called 800-USA-RAIL and was informed that 98 serves breakfast until 10:00 a.m. I was surprised to read that the diner didn't open until 9, so I wonder if it actually opens earlier than WPB. I would think that the diner crew would report early enough that the diner would open when the train departs MIA since it departs the originating station at normal breakfast time. Is there a reason that diner crews wouldn't be scheduled to arrive in time to prepare for the diner to begin serving at departure time?
Well there is always a reason for everything. The real question is there a valid reason or is it simply laziness on the part of the crew and lack of management that they don't open earlier. Now I personally can't speak to all of the issues, including the most important one, cost. However if I can be sitting in the dining car on the Lake Shore Limited at 7:20 PM enjoying my salad and my glass of wine, more than a half an hour before scheduled departure out of Chicago, then it is certainly possible for the crew to be serving breakfast as the train departs Miami. Especially since breakfast is an easier meal than dinner, and typically less busy for the dining car crew.
So the question remains, why? Is it cost, is it the fact that it's a less popular meal, or perhaps both? Or is it that the crew doesn't care and managment doesn't follow up? I honestly don't know what the reason(s) are, but it is certainly possible to do as proven by the LSL crews out of Chicago.
I do recall that on the old Silver Palm when I boarded at Hollywood, I was eating dinner in the diner before we called at WPB. I seem to recall first call being around Deerfield to Delray Beach.
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