do prisons put newly-released prisoners on Amtrak trains?

[tp49]

The San Joaquin's are also popular with families heading to Wasco or Corcoran for visitation day. Surely a better transportation situation for them then having to find their way to someplace like Susanville.

 

[Kenneth]

They do in Illinois. Had 4 subjects ride from southern IL to Chicago on one of my trips. While waiting, there was one correctional officer with them. He told them to behave or he would take them right back to the prison with him. That he had the authority to do that. This was in DuQuoin.

 

[the Other Mike]

I'd rather 10 ex cons than one lounge lizard

< flame shields UP >

 

[Ryan]

Just remember that a released prisoner is just like any other citizen. Once they are released, they have to get somewhere somehow. It may be by bus, it may be by Amtrak, it may be by plane, it may be by walking, it may be by being driven! Just think, that car next to you at the stoplight may actually contain someone who was once in prison! (The horrors! )
And not every "released prisoner" is not a murderer, rapist, bank robber, etc... Believe it or not, someone may been in prison for having 3 beers, or not paying a $100 debt, or may have even been innocent! (I've heard of people who were on death row for 20-30 years - and then were found to be innocent after another person confessed to "their crime"!)

You may even find released prisoners at stores shopping, at restaurants eating, at the movie theater, on the ferry or even at the company you work for! Unless they're wearing a striped jumpsuit, how do you know the person is a released prisoner? :huh:

As an AU member, I'm getting sick of this subject that keeps coming up! :angry:

Agreed on all counts.

 

[Henry Kisor]

Portage, Wisconsin, on the Empire Builder route is a regular embarkation point for prisoners released from the max-security Columbia Correctional Facility. A couple of times I've waited for No. 8 there along with a newly sprung inmate and a couple of deputies, who stayed on the platform until the train had left. Both times the former inmates seemed nervous at their newfound freedom and on their best behavior. Never heard a word about them causing trouble on the train.

The only time I saw anything resembling difficulty was when a young inmate was put on the Zephyr somewhere in, I think, Nevada. He was well behaved except for his language, which featured four-letter words in every sentence, all of them calmly and quietly uttered. In the diner (where he was seated alone) the LSA finally told him that he would be removed from the car if he didn't stop with the obscenities. He settled down meekly. Apparently the change from prison culture to the outside can be difficult.

 

[ne52]

There was an article about this from a public radio station in Chicago recently:
http://www.wbez.org/news/hoodie-ten-bucks-and-train-ticket-106259

They're put on the train for the the same reason many others are taking it. Sometimes the train is the only scheduled service to a lot of remote areas.

 

[Guest]

Thanks for posting that article, ne52. It really gives the point of view of the ex-inmate. There's a sense of hopelessness.

 

[VentureForth]

I would only be really concerned for folks from the Big House still in their prison jumpsuits.... (not the release-issued sweat suits, but the orange, or the stripes, or whatever is being used INSIDE)

 

[Bob Dylan]

While not Train related, in Texas there are signs along the Highways in Areas where Prisons are Located (we have Alot of Prisons in Texas!) saying WARNING! PRISON AREA!! DO NOT PICK UP HITCHHIKERS! Since most of our Prisons are located in Rural Areas, released Cons usually are taken to the Closest Bus Station and you can tell from their Clothing (Cherap Prison Made civilian Stuuf)and Short Hair tht they are Releasesd Prisoners!

I have ridden in Louisiana on the Sunset Ltd. with Recently Released Ex-Cons and in California also which is Second only to Texas in the Number of Prisons! No problems observed, they first wanted a Drink of Alcohol, something to Eat and generally weren't too interested in conversing with Guys, Women were a Different Story!

 

[BCL]

While not Train related, in Texas there are signs along the Highways in Areas where Prisons are Located (we have Alot of Prisons in Texas!) saying WARNING! PRISON AREA!! DO NOT PICK UP HITCHHIKERS! Since most of our Prisons are located in Rural Areas, released Cons usually are taken to the Closest Bus Station and you can tell from their Clothing (Cherap Prison Made civilian Stuuf)and Short Hair tht they are Releasesd Prisoners!

I worked briefly in Folsom, California - which of course has a fairly well known prison on the outskirts of town. Actually two, with Folsom State Prison and the newer California State Prison, Sacramento next to each other and sharing a perimeter - even with two wardens.

And the Johnny Cash song would no longer apply, since there's no longer any heavy passenger rail going through town. I see the old railroad tracks, but they're miles away from the prison.

 

[benjibear]

Thanks for posting the interesting article. The fact that they made them wait to board the train last was interesting. I can see the struggle an ex-con can have being just released. There probably needs to be better transition programs for somebody being released.

 

[The Davy Crockett]

There probably needs to be better transition programs for somebody being released.

You mean more programs like this?

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I've never understood the pervasive hatred many folks seem to have for any incarcerated person, especially in a society where incarceration has become so rampant and widespread. I'm also confused as to where the rehabilitation part is supposed to be coming from. Our prison system takes petty criminals and forces them to survive among harder criminals for years or decades at a time based on laws that don't seem to care if the punishment actually fits the crime and we expect them to be more productive when they get out? The more I learn about America's for-profit prison system the less sense it makes to me. Kind of like our health care system.

 

[BCL]

I've never understood the pervasive hatred many folks seem to have for any incarcerated person, especially in a society where incarceration has become so rampant and widespread. I'm also confused as to where the rehabilitation part is supposed to be coming from. Our prison system takes petty criminals and forces them to survive among harder criminals for years or decades at a time based on laws that don't seem to care if the punishment actually fits the crime and we expect them to be more productive when they get out? The more I learn about America's for-profit prison system the less sense it makes to me. Kind of like our health care system.

Should be pretty simple. Many in prison are there for violent crimes. Once their sentences are served, they must be released even if there's a decent chance that they might commit another crime. A slight majority of prisoners return to prison. I'm not sure if I'd worry about a recently released prisoner commiting another crime that quickly - as in on the ride to their initial destination. Most return to a life of crime after they fail to adjust to life outside prison.

A lot is fear of the unknown. For the most part we hear "released prisoner" without understanding the circumstances. Even so, most people are uncomfortable with the thought of being around someone who was in prison. Most probably deserved it.

That being said, I'm all for programs to try and give former prisoners chances at a normal life. I had dinner once with my family at the excellent Delancey Street Restaurant in San Francisco. They take former offenders and train them in how to run a restaurant. Our waiter was extremely dligent and probably happy to be there rather than behind bars.

 

[Guest]

Just remember that a released prisoner is just like any other citizen. Once they are released, they have to get somewhere somehow. It may be by bus, it may be by Amtrak, it may be by plane, it may be by walking, it may be by being driven! Just think, that car next to you at the stoplight may actually contain someone who was once in prison! (The horrors! )
And not every "released prisoner" is not a murderer, rapist, bank robber, etc... Believe it or not, someone may been in prison for having 3 beers, or not paying a $100 debt, or may have even been innocent! (I've heard of people who were on death row for 20-30 years - and then were found to be innocent after another person confessed to "their crime"!)

You may even find released prisoners at stores shopping, at restaurants eating, at the movie theater, on the ferry or even at the company you work for! Unless they're wearing a striped jumpsuit, how do you know the person is a released prisoner? :huh:

As an AU member, I'm getting sick of this subject that keeps coming up! :angry:

Thank You for saying that, Traveler.

I agree with Traveler. Thank you.

Well, put Traveler!

Amtrak isn't transporting prisoners, like from one facility to another. Once released, they paid their "debt", and as Traveler put, they are just regular ol' people.



Though, just to add a joke, it would be illegal to "house" a prisoner in a Roomette; too small.

 

[AlanB]

Well, you have to get released prisoners back to society somehow. So you have to buy a ticket for them. Most prisoners are not that dangerous, and they probably wouldn't cherish an immeidate return to jail.

Don't look too weak or special, and no one will attack you. T-shirts, jeans, sneakers. Preferably dirty sneaker. You want to look poor yet pack a punch, because poor people usually don't get attacked.

***? Dude, I just don't even have a comeback for that.......

What's wrong? I understand that people who work for Amtrak, like you, probably won't like this to worsen the company's reputation, but the poorer you seem, the less trouble you have, as long as you don't act suspicously.

Only he doesn't work for Amtrak! Many years ago he worked for Amtrak; but he doesn't work for it now. And RRDude has often been one of the harsher critics of Amtrak around here, so clearly he's not worried too much about tarnishing Amtrak's reputation.

 

[bmorechris]

Well, you have to get released prisoners back to society somehow. So you have to buy a ticket for them. Most prisoners are not that dangerous, and they probably wouldn't cherish an immeidate return to jail.
Don't look too weak or special, and no one will attack you. T-shirts, jeans, sneakers. Preferably dirty sneaker. You want to look poor yet pack a punch, because poor people usually don't get attacked.

This is completely incorrect, people with lower socioeconomic status are much more likely to be the victims of crime.

see http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cvus0801.pdf page 27,Table 14. Personal crimes, 2008:Victimization rates for persons age 12 or older,

by type of crime and annual family income of victims
People with incomes below $15k/yr are over 3 times as likely to be the victims of crime as people with incomes over $75k/yr. For those with incomes of $15k-$50k, they are twice as likely to be victims as the over $75k group. That is for all violent crime, but the same holds for just robbery.

You may think you hear about more victims with higher socioeconomic status, but that is usually because those victims get more play on the news. Every morning on the local news (Baltimore) they spend 30 seconds on the previous nights murders and assaults in the city. Someone gets murdered or assaulted in the suburbs? It will be the lead story for 3 straight days. I will withhold from further social commentary, but your premise is false.

 

[Railroad Bill]

To add a bit of humor to this thread, I will mention an escaped prisoner from a local prison decided to board the local freight that passes nearby the prison walls. He probably thought he had made a great getaway except that this train runs daily on a 15 mile-run northbound and then stops at the end of the trackage and turns around . Back to the prison again

Next time he should look up where the railroad tracks go before he decides to hitch a ride :help:

 

[the_traveler]

Sound like most Amtrak trips - round trip to where you began the trip! :giggle: But Amtrak is a more comfortable ride, and both destinations are better!

And you get AGR points - not more time in the big house with double thick walls with razor wire on top.

 

[Linda T]

I always thought it would be fun to have Martha Stewart leave Alderson on Amtrak. Guess she got released on one of the other four days. Maybe Greyhound? :giggle:

 

[BCL]

The San Joaquin's are also popular with families heading to Wasco or Corcoran for visitation day. Surely a better transportation situation for them then having to find their way to someplace like Susanville.

Pelican Bay.

There's talk about tearing down San Quentin. Marin County would live to do that and build housing with bay views and to add to their tax base. Some don't like the idea because its a convenient location for visitation. Others want to keep it because it has the only death row in California.

 

[tp49]

The San Joaquin's are also popular with families heading to Wasco or Corcoran for visitation day. Surely a better transportation situation for them then having to find their way to someplace like Susanville.

Pelican Bay.

There's talk about tearing down San Quentin. Marin County would live to do that and build housing with bay views and to add to their tax base. Some don't like the idea because its a convenient location for visitation. Others want to keep it because it has the only death row in California.

You can at least get to Crescent City by Amtrak (via bus from K-Falls on the Starlight.) Susanville is not reachable by anything other than private car.

 

[the_traveler]

I am again asking as an AU member - could we stop talking about prisoners on trains?

Yes, they may go on Amtrak. Yes, they may go on Greyhound. Yes, they may fly. Yes, they may be driven. So what? :huh: They did their time and "paid the penalty". They are free citizens as much as you and I! So all this talk makes me think that we should not be allowed to take Amtrak or Greyhound or ____ Airlines or drive either!

So can we please stop this talk? I think 47 posts is about 47 (OK 45) posts to many. Thank you!

 

[George Harris]

Well, you have to get released prisoners back to society somehow. So you have to buy a ticket for them. Most prisoners are not that dangerous, and they probably wouldn't cherish an immeidate return to jail.
Don't look too weak or special, and no one will attack you. T-shirts, jeans, sneakers. Preferably dirty sneaker. You want to look poor yet pack a punch, because poor people usually don't get attacked.

This is completely incorrect, people with lower socioeconomic status are much more likely to be the victims of crime.

see http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/cvus0801.pdf page 27,Table 14. Personal crimes, 2008:Victimization rates for persons age 12 or older,

by type of crime and annual family income of victims
People with incomes below $15k/yr are over 3 times as likely to be the victims of crime as people with incomes over $75k/yr. For those with incomes of $15k-$50k, they are twice as likely to be victims as the over $75k group. That is for all violent crime, but the same holds for just robbery.

This has more to do with the realities of where you can afford to live than anything else. The poorer you are the further down the scale you are in where you can afford to live. If you are poor or even middle class, you cannot afford the distant suburbs, gated communities, apartment complexes with sealed entrances, etc. that isolates the high income from a lot of the exposure you would have to become a victim.

That said, I regard this best to look as if in poverty when on a train as downright silly. Just be sort of "normal" Don't leave your valuables out, but you are not likely to get hit over the head and robbed while on the train. This happening in the vicinity of some of the stations could be another story.

 

[BCL]

The San Joaquin's are also popular with families heading to Wasco or Corcoran for visitation day. Surely a better transportation situation for them then having to find their way to someplace like Susanville.

Pelican Bay.

There's talk about tearing down San Quentin. Marin County would live to do that and build housing with bay views and to add to their tax base. Some don't like the idea because its a convenient location for visitation. Others want to keep it because it has the only death row in California.

You can at least get to Crescent City by Amtrak (via bus from K-Falls on the Starlight.) Susanville is not reachable by anything other than private car.

I checked the schedule. Only on the CS to Klamath Falls (10 hours from the Bay Area) and an 8 hour bus ride to Crescent City scheduled to arrive at 8 PM. Then another 8 miles to Pelican Bay. Do they have taxis?

However, I was thinking from the perspective of someone who was planning on driving. Getting to Crescent City takes longer to get to than Susanville for anyone coming from the Bay Area, Sacramento, or further south. I've been that way before to get to Lassen Volcanic NP. Along the way I saw a Walmart truck or two, which were either headed to Chester and/or Susanville.

I know a HS athletic coach whose team had to play in Crescent City for a CIF-North Coast Section playoff game. He was ticked off about the distance. They chartered a bus to go about 350 miles along windy portions of US-101 from the Bay Area. The section extended from parts of the Bay Area all the way up to the Oregon border. It cost his kids two days of school, and they handily won. The reason why they traveled was some odd rule about league champions getting hosting priority, even though the team that lost basically dominated a weak league. Never been up there myself, but I was thinking of taking the family to Redwood NP.