New Consist Arrangement forSilver Service and the Crescent

[had8ley]

It's about time! This had been talked about on several occasions over the last few years. There has long been a safety issue existing with having no vestibule exit at one end of the dining car. I, for what it is worth, believe this is in the best interest of safety, and it will allow the sleepers to placed in their rightful place in the consist. The first class passengers should be placed in the area away from the locos as they have paid a higher cost.
OBS gone freight...

Well all they really needed to do was to flip the Viewliner attached to the diner so as to have the bedroom side with the vestibule next to the diner. Don't really need to reorganize the entire consist to accomplish that.

As for the horn issue, that's a matter of preference. Some like it, some don't.

Yes, that would have accomplished having a vestibule at both ends of the diner, however, we still would have two places where there was no vestibule side door between two cars (currently between the lounge and the first coach and the diner and the first sleeper). Switching one Viewliner around would place a vestibule door next to the front of the diner as well, but then we would still have two Viewliners coupled together with no vestibule door to exit between.

Assuming the cars will be placed as listed in the first posting (with all the coaches and lounge and their vestibule doors towards the rear and the Viewliners doors facing forwards), this will allow for a entrance/exit available at both ends of each car (with no gaps per se) with the exception of the first coach and baggage care (which a door there really wouldn't be necessary). So therefore, this is a really good move in the name of safety!

The only thing that I am a little concerned about is the potential ride quality of the Viewliners being on the rear of the train. They are not as heavy as the old streamliner sleepers (10-6 etc), and may ride a little rougher on the rear of the train. But with that said there shouldn't be any weight issues as far as consist placement with the Amfleet coaches placed closer to the locos.

OBS gone freight...

OBS;

I agree with you on the weight factor of the Viewliners. The Southern had a dome parlor that used to ride between Atlanta and New Orleans~ the view was terrific but being on the tail end and a lightweight car it shook your fillings out. Before the CONO went Superliner it had a dome coach that rode nicely mid-train. I'm sure you've met a few trains that were traveling at track speed and noticed empty hoppers jumping from side to side. I have a feeling no matter where they put the sleepers there will be opinions on both sides of the track. BTW, the coaches first out might lend credence to the rumor that the Crescent is going to set out/pick up the two deadhead coaches in Atlanta that its been dragging around between Atlanta and New Orleans for years.

 

[Grandma B]

Since we booked our reservations in Feb for July, what are the chances that we won't be the very last sleeping car????

Your reservation states which car you are in, for example 9720, or 9810, and also your room number.

The lower the car number, xx10, xx20, etc. the closer you are to the diner. The highest number is the last car on the train.

Hope this helps

Mike

Mike, we've got the following reservations: I guess we won't know till we get to NYP, since we don't know the other car numbers that will be in the consist.

NYP - WPB Car 9710 - Room 001 (Roomette)

WPB - NYP Car 9811 - Room 001 ( " " " )

Going south you'll be in the sleeping car closest to the dining car. Coming back north, you'll be one sleeper removed from the dining car. And unless there has been some change that takes the third sleeper off the Meteor, you won't be the last car in either direction.

Thank you Alan for the info.

 

[battalion51]

Yay for more dumb ideas! :angry: Amtrak continues to fail to realize the way these trains are worked. The Conductor or AC will work the baggage car and the sleepers, while his counterpart will work the coaches. This means that the person working the baggage and sleepers will have to be walking the length of the train A LOT. Just like when they had the baggage on the rear of the Star/Crescent (essentially the opposite of this plan) it DIDN'T work. The baggage car needs to be next to the sleepers. Period.

 

[Roy]

Does the Crescent have two or three sleepers?

 

[ExtonFlyer]

The baggage car needs to be next to the sleepers. Period.

What about the possibility of putting the baggage car at the end of the train? This would at least make the sleepers one car further from the rear (to address ride quality) and also position the sleepers and baggage car next to each other (to address battalion51's point in the quoted post). Feasible?

 

[battalion51]

It would be the ideal situation in my mind. Just make that 43 car the car you do with all your shorts, and you probably won't hear too many complaints from the PAXs.

 

[SUNSETLIMITED01]

So the Silver Service and Crescent will look kind of like this right here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0N_7fCGP0O0

 

[AlanB]

Yay for more dumb ideas! :angry: Amtrak continues to fail to realize the way these trains are worked. The Conductor or AC will work the baggage car and the sleepers, while his counterpart will work the coaches. This means that the person working the baggage and sleepers will have to be walking the length of the train A LOT. Just like when they had the baggage on the rear of the Star/Crescent (essentially the opposite of this plan) it DIDN'T work. The baggage car needs to be next to the sleepers. Period.

Or the person working the coaches could just work the baggage car too.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

Yay for more dumb ideas! :angry: Amtrak continues to fail to realize the way these trains are worked. The Conductor or AC will work the baggage car and the sleepers, while his counterpart will work the coaches. This means that the person working the baggage and sleepers will have to be walking the length of the train A LOT. Just like when they had the baggage on the rear of the Star/Crescent (essentially the opposite of this plan) it DIDN'T work. The baggage car needs to be next to the sleepers. Period.

Or the person working the coaches could just work the baggage car too.

Sounds perfectly reasonable to me...

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

Or the person working the coaches could just work the baggage car too.

But aren't there more sleeper attendants per passenger (and thus probably less work for the conductor on that end of the train) than coach attendants per passenger?

 

[AlanB]

Or the person working the coaches could just work the baggage car too.

But aren't there more sleeper attendants per passenger (and thus probably less work for the conductor on that end of the train) than coach attendants per passenger?

Conductors don't do the work of coach attendants and sleeping car attendants, so I'm not sure what that has to do with the price of eggs.

 

[jis]

What does a coach attendant or sleeper attendant have to do with baggage car handling? At least on the Lake Shore Limited yesterday the sleeper attendants didn't get anywhere near the baggage car. It was the baggage handler from the station who did the baggage handling in the baggage car. The conductor occasionally came down to yell at them when they were taking too much time. But that was about it. I suspect that is why there is baggage service only at a few stations. It is not like Greyhound where the driver just pops open the baggage hold and provides baggage service at each stop.

 

[had8ley]

Or the person working the coaches could just work the baggage car too.

But aren't there more sleeper attendants per passenger (and thus probably less work for the conductor on that end of the train) than coach attendants per passenger?

Conductors don't do the work of coach attendants and sleeping car attendants, so I'm not sure what that has to do with the price of eggs.

Silver Service and the Crescent rarely exceed 12 cars~try telling a freight conductor that has to walk an 8,000 foot train back and forth that the A/C has too much walking to do to work bags. VIA has the second engineer working the baggage car.

 

[Tony]

Honestly, I haven't noticed the sleepers being any more noisier with the ol' dorm car gone. Now writing that, I have to (with apologies to Alan) wonder if the sleepers will indeed be noticeably quieter at night. I mean, the Silvers aren't anywhere near the AT in overall length so the sleepers aren't going to all that far from the engine.

The only thing I can think of, is this will eliminate the crew walking thru the sleeperr cars.

 

[Guest]

IMHO, the reason behind this change is that there are number of wreaked Superliners, now being rebuilt. By putting the Viewliners on the rear of the train, this will increase the possibility of them being "totalled" in a rear collision, and therefore, become eligible to be rebuilt with Stimulus money.

 

[SUNSETLIMITED01]

That video is possibly the closest the exapmle to what's going to happen this wedenesday with th exception of a couple of things.

 

[guestlsa]

Honestly, I haven't noticed the sleepers being any more noisier with the ol' dorm car gone. Now writing that, I have to (with apologies to Alan) wonder if the sleepers will indeed be noticeably quieter at night. I mean, the Silvers aren't anywhere near the AT in overall length so the sleepers aren't going to all that far from the engine.
The only thing I can think of, is this will eliminate the crew walking thru the sleeperr cars.

first of all the crew (well those who sleep in the 10 car will fartherest from the diner) but I still will have walk though to take resvertions(sorry 4 typo) and I just only will have to walk backwards. The only thing i can really think is that coming into New Orleans we back into the station

 

[Larry H.]

I for one would welcome a return of All sleepers to the rear which is the place most commonly used previous to amtrak. Yes it is quieter there and for another that diesel smell in the sleeper is very irritating on trains like the City of New Orleans where there is no baggage ahead of the sleepers any longer.

I love the idea of a lounge once again for lst class passengers only which also used to be very common and helped to make your extra payment worth it. One thing no sleeping on the floor coach passengers to deal with. I doubt we will ever see that, but we can hope.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

I for one would welcome a return of All sleepers to the rear which is the place most commonly used previous to amtrak. Yes it is quieter there and for another that diesel smell in the sleeper is very irritating on trains like the City of New Orleans where there is no baggage ahead of the sleepers any longer. I love the idea of a lounge once again for lst class passengers only which also used to be very common and helped to make your extra payment worth it. One thing no sleeping on the floor coach passengers to deal with. I doubt we will ever see that, but we can hope.

Yes, I remember that the sleepers were the last cars on the SSL during Big Bayou Canot were at the rear of the train and was the coach pax who ended in the drink...

When did Amtrak start putting sleepers at the front of trains?

 

[ourlouisiana]

We just returned from our trip on the Crescent Saturday night. There were 2 sleepers in front, diner, lounge, and 4 coaches. We like the front locatin of the sleepers because we are riding a train, and WANT to hear the horn.

We had the same trainset southbound #19 on the 17-18, as we had northbound #20 on the 11 - 12.

 

[AlanB]

Yes it is quieter there and for another that diesel smell in the sleeper is very irritating on trains like the City of New Orleans where there is no baggage ahead of the sleepers any longer.

Actually that has more to do with the lack of a Trans/Dorm, than it does with the lack of a bag. It's the Trans/Dorm, with its head end door that connects to single level cars that keeps the exhaust out of the Superliner cars. With a single level consist, everything is below the stack level of the P42 so you don't have any problems. But with the Superliners in general, the "front door", if you will, is right at the stack level.

Without a Trans/Dorm's lower level "front door", you have a problem. I've been in a Superliner with a bag between me and the engine, and no Trans/Dorm, and the exhaust was still a problem.

 

[ourlouisiana]

Only benefit that we can see to putting the sleepers at the rear ..... leaving NOL, it's a long walk up the 4 coaches, lounge and diner to get to the sleeper !!!!! The same thing with any "terminal" station.

 

[TEREB]

It's dumb "senior" questions: :blink: Will we still hear the sound of the horn as we pass by all those "out of the way" country crossings down south? Also, how is the ride at the end of the train vs the front besides being quieter??

You'll probably only hear it when the train is on a curve and the sound carries better.

As for the ride, if you're in the very last sleeping car, then it could be a bit rougher than it would have been had Amtrak not changed things.

We just came back from 97/98 and thought the engine noise/horn was not at all that bad.

The bouncing on the return home, however, was another story. It was terrible. We had to fold the in room magazine in quarters to stick between the connecting door to keep it from rattling. We also stuffed the closet, cabinet, entry doors, and placed towels on the ladder to stop that noise. Can the ride in the rear be much worse that that??

On train 97, we were in the "b" bedroom in the car closest to the baggage car. The bouncing was not quite so bad in this car.

We bounced so hard coming home (we were late 1 1/2 hrs) that I continued to rock for the next full day :blink: . On train 98 we were in the "a" bedroom next to the diner.

BTW, I had the crab cakes and thought they were delicious.

 

[Larry H.]

I know there are all kinds of other things that can go wrong, but I still sleep sounder at the rear. I have brought up previously the old Pullman signs that bragged how many years no one had been killed in a sleeping car. The main reason for that was the avoidance of the cars becoming severely mangled in a head end derailment or crash. It may be that the rear end could be hit also, but my guess is that most fatalities occur up front in a bad train accident. I can't think of too many fatal rear end crashes involving a passenger train in many years. But I can living down the line recall all the deaths in the City of New Orleans due to the sleepers being up front. I don't wish injury on anyone, but most times the rear cars are still sitting upright on the tracks while havoc can occur up front.

 

[wayman]

BTW, I had the crab cakes and thought they were delicious.

The new menus are out already? I thought that wasn't until summer!...