Reserved Seats??

[jackal]

WHY can't Amtrak assign specific seats? The airlines do (except maybe Southwest, but that's their choice).

I don't think it's a matter of can't (though with 2V [haha! I said I was going to use that], I'm not sure I'd trust them to be able to pull it off in a smooth manner...) but rather just that the benefit isn't worth the cost.

I agree with the_trav (someone called him that elsewhere, and I think I'm going to appropriate its use) that I would rather not have preassigned seating on long-distance trains. The equipment is simply too variable. I want the freedom to move to another row if the window is aligned better or it has an available power outlet or another coach if the HVAC is malfunctioning or there's a noisy third-grade school group.

Preassigned seating would work fine on Acela, where the cars are pretty much mostly uniform, but on any other train, you can get stuck with all manner of different equipment.

 

[Tony]

I would have liked it better if Amtrak had both (kept both?) reserved and unreserved seating, but possibly redefined what that meant.

There would be "open seating" coach cars, with those passengers holding an unreserved seating ticket. There would be "assigned seating" coach cars, with those passengers holding a reserved seating ticket.

People traveling alone could go for the unreserved tickets and save themselves a few bucks. Families and couples could go for the reserved tickets and ensure they all sit together in a group.

Also, I think that Business Class should always have the amenity of a pre-assigned seat. As a tangent, IMHO is that Amtrak's Business Class has lost almost all of its perks, with the only remaining perk really being just a 1/2 can of warm soda. A "seat with your name on it" would help to add back, some of the lost "class" in Business Class.

Trains that have Business Class would not offer seat reserved coach too. Trains that don't have a Business Class would offer seat reserved coach. That would help maintain Business Class having a unique distinction.

 

[Tony]

But remember, you can say "Yes" or you can say "No, I'd rather not" - and most likely, they'll ask someone else. I don't think they carry cattle prods! (At least I didn't see any CA's have them yet.)

While not cattle prods, I thought that Amtrak's rules state all passengers must follow the instructions of the Conductor, or the Conductor has the authority to throw them off the train?

I don't think that most passengers would think they have the right to say "no" to the Conductor, without any consequences.

 

[Tony]

I agree with the_trav (someone called him that elsewhere, and I think I'm going to appropriate its use) that I would rather not have preassigned seating on long-distance trains. The equipment is simply too variable. I want the freedom to move to another row if the window is aligned better or it has an available power outlet or another coach if the HVAC is malfunctioning or there's a noisy third-grade school group.

With today's crowded trains, I would venture to say that in all likelihood, that other seat you move to, is a seat already being used by someone else. Someone who might have gone to the rest room, or the lounge, or the dining car, and plans on coming back to the same seat.

I would not be very happy if I had to worry that if I got up to go to the bathroom, that any passenger would have the right to take my seat while I am gone.

 

[the_traveler]

I agree with the_trav (someone called him that elsewhere, and I think I'm going to appropriate its use) that I would rather not have preassigned seating on long-distance trains. The equipment is simply too variable. I want the freedom to move to another row if the window is aligned better or it has an available power outlet or another coach if the HVAC is malfunctioning or there's a noisy third-grade school group.

With today's crowded trains, I would venture to say that in all likelihood, that other seat you move to, is a seat already being used by someone else. Someone who might have gone to the rest room, or the lounge, or the dining car, and plans on coming back to the same seat.

I would not be very happy if I had to worry that if I got up to go to the bathroom, that any passenger would have the right to take my seat while I am gone.

That's part of the reason for the seat checks. If there is a seat check above the seat number for the window seat (on the luggage rack rail), it means the window seat is occupied. Or if there's a coat (or similar) on the seat, most likely it's occupied.

You said BC should have an assigned seat? :huh: One of the reasons you may choose BC is so you can work on your laptop, and you wand a power plug. How about if the power at your (assigned) seat doesn't work? :huh:

 

[Tony]

You said BC should have an assigned seat? :huh: One of the reasons you may choose BC is so you can work on your laptop, and you wand a power plug. How about if the power at your (assigned) seat doesn't work? :huh:

I thought one of the perks of BC, was that each seat row had a working electric outlet.

Of course, if there is a problem with any assigned seat, bad outlet, coffee poured all over the seat, the seat back broke off, the conductor or assistant could always re-assigned a BC passenger to an empty seat. If there are no empty seats, then having an assigned seat or not, doesn't matter. There is no alternative place in the BC car to sit.

As a counter example, how about a business group of 4 passengers, wishing to reserve the (only) four seats with a common work table? Or simply needing to sit together to plot their last minute presentation strategy.

 

[the_traveler]

You said BC should have an assigned seat? :huh: One of the reasons you may choose BC is so you can work on your laptop, and you wand a power plug. How about if the power at your (assigned) seat doesn't work? :huh:

I thought one of the perks of BC, was that each seat row had a working electric outlet.

Of course, if there is a problem with any assigned seat, bad outlet, coffee poured all over the seat, the seat back broke off, the conductor or assistant could always re-assigned a BC passenger to an empty seat. If there are no empty seats, then having an assigned seat or not, doesn't matter. There is no alternative place in the BC car to sit.

As a counter example, how about a business group of 4 passengers, wishing to reserve the (only) four seats with a common work table? Or simply needing to sit together to plot their last minute presentation strategy.

How about if you board in BC at station X, but find that the plug at "seat #5" doesn't work or there's coffee spilled on the seat before the train departs the station. When you board, there are also 5 other empty seats in BC. But then 5 other passengers board BC before the train departs. However, you couldn't move because your "assigned seat" is #5. But if it wasn't assigned, you could have chosen any of the 6 seats that you saw open when you boarded!

As far as a group, I'm not sure, but I believe if you make a request when making your reservation, they may make a notation and block those seats with a "reserved" sign or something. (I have seen signs saying something like "reserved for groups" or "reserved for families".)

BTW - I have never seen tables in Business Class.

 

[Neil_M]

"Reserved Seats" on Amtrak is one of my pet peeves that I spout off about over the years. You have been warned.
Anyway, DB in Germany somehow manages to reserve one a specific seat on a specific coach on a specific train. This was happening in the mid-to-late 1980's while I was stationed in Germany.

The very helpful DB website now allows you to reserve seats online and print out the reservation at home for the grand sum of 2 Euros.

This allows you to have a specific seat on a train plus one onward connecting train as well. You can even use it in conjunction with railway staff free passes, which is very useful!

I cannot see why Amtrak cannot do the same, allowing you to have a seat with your name on for a little extra. 'Reserved coach' is just a joke and means nothing in practice.

 

[PRR 60]

I rode the California Zephyr and the El Capitan with my family in 1963 and we had reserved seats in both trains. That is reserved as in a car and seat numbers, not just a sort-of promise that there are probably seats somewhere, and if things work out they may even be together. Maybe it is time for Amtrak to match the reservation services of 45 years ago?

 

[jackal]

I might be in favor of reserved seats if I could be sure to reserve seat 33 or 54 (or whichever the two with power outlets are). Or maybe these could be blocked off and made available only to those with Select or Select Plus status!

Then the only thing left is for Amtrak to stop giving cheap refundable fares and offering food on board...then they'll be AmAirlines! :lol:

 

[Tony]

BTW - I have never seen tables in Business Class.

You need to start traveling Business Class more often. I have seen a table in about 1/2 of my trips.

 

[Tony]

As far as a group, I'm not sure, but I believe if you make a request when making your reservation, they may make a notation and block those seats with a "reserved" sign or something. (I have seen signs saying something like "reserved for groups" or "reserved for families".)

Putting a "reserved" sign or something on the seats? Isn't that, then, reserved/assigned seating?

How is that all that really different, than from putting the seat numbers onto their tickets when making the reservation? Amtrak gets to keep the seat numbers a big surprise until boarding?

Sorry, but I think a lot more passengers would like the security of assigned seats for themselves and their companions, than there are those passengers who want to be able to play musical chairs and "sample" each seat in the car on their trip. I mean, just look at all the threads here, from families concerned over if they will be able to sit together.

 

[the_traveler]

BTW - I have never seen tables in Business Class.

You need to start traveling Business Class more often. I have seen a table in about 1/2 of my trips.

Are you talking about Business Class on something like the Regionals? Or are you talking about Business Class on the Acela Express? :huh: Yes, I've seen them in Business Class on the AE, but remember that AE only offers Business Class (low) and First Class (high) seating. (No coach seating.)

 

[julieandrews]

I find it quite strange that Amtrak don't assign seats - I had assumed that they would for such long journeys.

Here in Britain you can reserve a seat on all long distance journeys. A ticket is then placed on your seat detailing the section of the route that the seat is reserved for, so anybody getting on board who hasn't reserved a seat knows to either sit at a seat with no reservation ticket, or else one where the the section of the route it is reserved for isn't the same as theirs. Generally people stick to this very well and anybody who has the cheek to sit in a reserved seat is kicked out of the seat faster than you can say 'you loser' and becomes a leper in the eyes of the other surrounding passengers

 

[MrFSS]

I find it quite strange that Amtrak don't assign seats - I had assumed that they would for such long journeys.
Here in Britain you can reserve a seat on all long distance journeys. A ticket is then placed on your seat detailing the section of the route that the seat is reserved for, so anybody getting on board who hasn't reserved a seat knows to either sit at a seat with no reservation ticket, or else one where the the section of the route it is reserved for isn't the same as theirs. Generally people stick to this very well and anybody who has the cheek to sit in a reserved seat is kicked out of the seat faster than you can say 'you loser' and becomes a leper in the eyes of the other surrounding passengers

Well - you folks across the pond are always much more civilized than we Yanks have been.

 

[Ryan]

But remember, you can say "Yes" or you can say "No, I'd rather not" - and most likely, they'll ask someone else. I don't think they carry cattle prods! (At least I didn't see any CA's have them yet.)

While not cattle prods, I thought that Amtrak's rules state all passengers must follow the instructions of the Conductor, or the Conductor has the authority to throw them off the train?

I don't think that most passengers would think they have the right to say "no" to the Conductor, without any consequences.

There's a difference between "Would you mind moving?" and "I'm going to need to ask you to move". "No, I'd rather not" is a perfectly acceptable answer to one, but not the other.

As far as "open" vs "assigned" seating, I'd much rather leave it in the capable hands of the coach attendants to manage the seating in their car, than have Amtrak go to the time, effort and expense of a more complicated, less adaptable system.

 

[julieandrews]

But remember, you can say "Yes" or you can say "No, I'd rather not" - and most likely, they'll ask someone else. I don't think they carry cattle prods! (At least I didn't see any CA's have them yet.)

While not cattle prods, I thought that Amtrak's rules state all passengers must follow the instructions of the Conductor, or the Conductor has the authority to throw them off the train?

I don't think that most passengers would think they have the right to say "no" to the Conductor, without any consequences.

There's a difference between "Would you mind moving?" and "I'm going to need to ask you to move". "No, I'd rather not" is a perfectly acceptable answer to one, but not the other.

As far as "open" vs "assigned" seating, I'd much rather leave it in the capable hands of the coach attendants to manage the seating in their car, than have Amtrak go to the time, effort and expense of a more complicated, less adaptable system.

There's nothing expensive about it, they obviously already use a computer system to track booking and they already assign sleeper rooms so it's not a big deal to stretch this to coach seats.

Its not complicated, the system prints out the seat tickets which the attendant can place at the seats. For journeys as long as those on Amtrack it would probably make sense to only allow reservation up to 24 hrs before a trains initial departure and after that, people would have to fight for the remaining seats once they get on board as they already do

For effort, it's not that much effort for an attendant to place the tickets on the seats before the trains departure, it would probably save them a lot of hassle in the long run

It's perfectly adaptable, one click of a mouse makes any changes

For those worried about being assigned to a carraige full of noisey kids, British long distance trains have at least 2 'quiet' carriages with no mobile phones, no noisey kids or boisterous conversation etc allowed

 

[AlanB]

There's nothing expensive about it, they obviously already use a computer system to track booking and they already assign sleeper rooms so it's not a big deal to stretch this to coach seats.

You are correct and Amtrak actually has all the pieces in place now to do this. When Amtrak first introduced Acela, one was not only assigned a seat if you booked First Class, one could actually pick your own seat. They had a really nice diagram, much like many airlines use for their planes, that showed you each and every seat, which way it faced, and whether or not it had a table. It even showed you which seats were already sold. At one point in time it was rumored that they were going to use that same software to actually let people choose the sleeping compartment that they wanted, but it never materialized for one reason or another.

So in any event, all one had to do was to click on the seat one wanted, and assuming that it wasn't already booked, it was your seat.

So no major programming or major overhauls is needed to do assigned seating. Amtrak already has a system in place that will permit them to do it. It would really just be a matter of training the crew and the passengers to deal with assigned seating, as well as dealing with problems like a last minute equipment change.

 

[x-press]

Amtrak coach travel, particularly in the crowded Northeast, is no longer enjoyable for me, for this very reason (lack of assigned seating). For all the whining people do about Southwest Airlines, I find their boarding process to be absolutely ZEN-LIKE compared to the "hillbilly fire drill" in New York Penn Station . . . and I haven't done that one since the gas prices went through the roof. It is completely unacceptable, especially at the prices Amtrak charges, to have people in business suits falling all over themselves, sneaking through lower level entrances before boarding call, and rudely cutting in line all in the name of getting good seats (or, in the event of over-booking, ANY seats).

- I don't understand why Amtrak does not assign cars/seats.

- I don't understand why anyone wouldn't WANT them to assign cars/seats, especially if you could choose which one you wanted (you can do it on airlines, including discount airlines; you can do it on cruise ships; Alan B says they even HAVE the frickin' software). People always object to assigned seating . . . as long as they get the exact seat they want!

Can you imagine: Rush hour, Friday night, Northeast Corridor, New York Penn Station, jerks cutting in line in front of you and rushing down the stairs . . . yet all you do is laugh, because you have an assigned seat just for you! I'm so happy at the thought, I may just float away!

There would be no reason to simply change the whole system overnight, either. Start with Acela First Class. See how it works and tweak as necessary (yes, I'm aware they tried it in the past; try it AGAIN). Move on to select Acelas during the day on a trial basis. Offer a "reserved seating car" with a surcharge (sign me up). Eventually, I strongly suspect it would catch on and spread given today's loads.

JPS

 

[the_traveler]

Its not complicated, the system prints out the seat tickets which the attendant can place at the seats. For journeys as long as those on Amtrack it would probably make sense to only allow reservation up to 24 hrs before a trains initial departure and after that, people would have to fight for the remaining seats once they get on board as they already do
For effort, it's not that much effort for an attendant to place the tickets on the seats before the trains departure, it would probably save them a lot of hassle in the long run

The thing is that across the pond, many trips are a few hours long. The western LD trains on Amtrak can be 50 hours long!

As suggested, the CA could put tickets on the seat. Using the TE as an example, here's a possible use of seat #14:

• CHI-STL
  
• STL-LIT
  
• LIT-DAL
  
• FTW-AUS
  
• AUS-SAS
  
• SAS-ELP
  
• ELP-TUS
  
• MRC-LAX
  

Where is the CA to put all these tickets? :huh: And the seat next to #14 may have as many "tickets" (or more) upon departure from CHI. Along with the other 40-50 seats in the car!

At least on a plane, most people board at the originating airport and most do not leave until the plane gets to the next airport! A train could have 4-5 complete turnovers of passengers between CHI and LAX or SEA! 1 seat may be occupied by 9-10 different passengers on the CZ between CHI-EMY!

 

[Walt]

- I don't understand why anyone wouldn't WANT them to assign cars/seats, especially if you could choose which one you wanted (you can do it on airlines, including discount airlines; you can do it on cruise ships; Alan B says they even HAVE the frickin' software). People always object to assigned seating . . . as long as they get the exact seat they want!

I don't understand the strong sediment here, against allowing assigned cars/seats, either. :unsure:

Gosh, I don't think of it, as strongly as some, as some basic "right" that's being abridged. The "right" to change seats at will. As simply being realistic, IMHO, one is lucky today to find one seat. It is not like one has a continuous choice of 12 empty seats, and one can play 'music chairs' constantly moving amongst them all during one's trip in some sort of parallel to Goldie Locks searching for the seat that is 'just right'.

And of course if something is actually wrong with the physical seat, I am sure that one could be re-assigned a new seat while onboard, if there are any available. As pointed out, with today's trains so crowded, there might not be any other seats available, and that is regardless of there being assigned seats or not.

Offer a "reserved seating car" with a surcharge (sign me up). Eventually, I strongly suspect it would catch on and spread given today's loads.

Me too. I would gladly pay a reasonable surcharge, for the piece of mind knowing that my entire family will be able to seat together. Or instead of a surcharge, again as already mentioned, make it a BC perk.

Or if lucky, snag the coveted seat 33 or 56 in coach, months in advanced.

 

[amamba]

But remember, you can say "Yes" or you can say "No, I'd rather not" - and most likely, they'll ask someone else. I don't think they carry cattle prods! (At least I didn't see any CA's have them yet.)

While not cattle prods, I thought that Amtrak's rules state all passengers must follow the instructions of the Conductor, or the Conductor has the authority to throw them off the train?

I don't think that most passengers would think they have the right to say "no" to the Conductor, without any consequences.

There's a difference between "Would you mind moving?" and "I'm going to need to ask you to move". "No, I'd rather not" is a perfectly acceptable answer to one, but not the other.

As far as "open" vs "assigned" seating, I'd much rather leave it in the capable hands of the coach attendants to manage the seating in their car, than have Amtrak go to the time, effort and expense of a more complicated, less adaptable system.

That's assuming that there are coach attendents. They don't have these on the NEC regionals. I have practically had to beg people to move their bags/laptops in order to sit in an empty seat after walking up and down the train and not finding anything open. I would welcome a coach attendent who could help persuade people to not hog two seats to themselves.

 

[x-press]

That's assuming that there are coach attendents. They don't have these on the NEC regionals. I have practically had to beg people to move their bags/laptops in order to sit in an empty seat after walking up and down the train and not finding anything open. I would welcome a coach attendent who could help persuade people to not hog two seats to themselves.

Amen! The attendant-assigned seating works "okay" in my experience for long distance trains, since they have the attendants to do it. It may not be perfect, but it's not awful. Conductors usually try their best on Northeast trains, but it's an uphill battle.

Let's see people try to steal the seats if/when Acela's currently "empty" displays are up and running!!!

Me: Excuse me, that's my seat.

Him: Why, does it have your name on it?

Me: Yes, it's on the display up here, even spelled it right this time.

Him: Oh.

 

[AlanB]

Let's see people try to steal the seats if/when Acela's currently "empty" displays are up and running!!!
Me: Excuse me, that's my seat.

Him: Why, does it have your name on it?

Me: Yes, it's on the display up here, even spelled it right this time.

Him: Oh.

Those displays above your head on Acela where never intended to show a passenger's name. They were only supposed to show your destination, that way other passenger's and crew members would know where you were detraining and of course when that seat would be empty. It would also indicated to the conductor that he/she now needs to ask the person sitting in the seat for their ticket, if the train was now past the stop displayed on the led display.

 

[x-press]

Let's see people try to steal the seats if/when Acela's currently "empty" displays are up and running!!!
Me: Excuse me, that's my seat.

Him: Why, does it have your name on it?

Me: Yes, it's on the display up here, even spelled it right this time.

Him: Oh.

Those displays above your head on Acela where never intended to show a passenger's name. They were only supposed to show your destination, that way other passenger's and crew members would know where you were detraining and of course when that seat would be empty. It would also indicated to the conductor that he/she now needs to ask the person sitting in the seat for their ticket, if the train was now past the stop displayed on the led display.

Alan,

Is there any chance they were used differently in first class? An acquaintance on another board said he booked a table in FC when the Acelas first rolled out, and his name appeared in the display.

Certainly possible his memory betrayed him after, what, seven years?

How were the the displays loaded? Even if they did only display the destination, they would certainly be more clear and helpful than the archaic seat check system, which many passengers don't even seem to notice, and even more experienced travelers (like me) can only figure out sporadically (ie: 1 seat check for two people, 1 seat check with a tear in it, different colors).

JPS