Saving $$ on Crescent ticket?

[John King]

We recently rode the Crescent from PHL to NOL in roomettes. After ATL it's all daylight - train not too crowded - and I think coach for that part of trip would be fine. Plus, lunch and abreviated dinner menu were nothing special. But when I went to book next year's trip - same run - I discovered there is a higher charge for roomette from PHL to ATL than if we just book the roomette from PHL to NOL. Why does it cost more to use the roomette for a shorter part of the trip?

As far as our recent trip - southbound SCA was almost invisible. Not attentive at all. Heading north the SCA was okay. But I find other routes have a more attentive staff by far. Anyone else experience this? Go figure. Go Amtrak.

 

[Ryan]

Supply and Demand - the train is really popular from the NE to ATL and runs very empty between ATL-NOL.

Tracktwentynine did some digging and put together a pretty good thread on it:

http://discuss.amtraktrains.com/index.php?/topic/35761-a-look-at-fares-on-the-crescent/

The Cardinal is another train with some interesting pricing.

 

[Bob Dylan]

We recently rode the Crescent from PHL to NOL in roomettes. After ATL it's all daylight - train not too crowded - and I think coach for that part of trip would be fine. Plus, lunch and abreviated dinner menu were nothing special. But when I went to book next year's trip - same run - I discovered there is a higher charge for roomette from PHL to ATL than if we just book the roomette from PHL to NOL. Why does it cost more to use the roomette for a shorter part of the trip?

As far as our recent trip - southbound SCA was almost invisible. Not attentive at all. Heading north the SCA was okay. But I find other routes have a more attentive staff by far. Anyone else experience this? Go figure. Go Amtrak.

The NOL-ATL run is still one of the few Bargains left on Amtrak, Roomette and 3 meals for two, Sleeping Car Fare, $50!!! :wub: There has been lots of talk about cutting the Sleepers in ATL since the overwhelming majority of the business on the Crescent in Sleepers is WAS/NYP-ATL.Say it isnt true! But I wouldnt expect the cheap fares to last much longer! Just buy the PHL-NOL ticket and get off in ATL!!! ^_^

As to the OBS, the Diner crew is based in New York, the rest of the OBS is out of

New Orleans, a strange mix of the North and the South! :wacko:

 

[Anderson]

Honestly, I expect them to cut it to one through sleeper past ATL rather than axing them all (both options make a certain amount of sense, but I suspect that Amtrak will ultimately be very hesitant not to offer some sort of ATL-NOL sleeper service lest they lose some sleeper pax to a forced second reservation on the leg)...but I could definitely see either option happening. I also wouldn't be shocked to see one or more coaches turned at ATL as well if they did this...it would make for an LSL-esque train in terms of the consist setup, but I definitely see something in this vein happening.

I could see a future situation, with the new Viewliner order coming online, where you have four sleepers to ATL (two from the present equipment allocation with turning, plus one from the new order pool) and only one to NOL. On the coaches, I'm not sure how radically different the demand situation is there, but I could also see 5 coaches NYP-ATL and 2-3 ATL-NOL (either keeping the equipment allocation the same or even transferring two coaches to a different part of the single-level system, such as the Cardinal).

 

[GaSteve]

Honestly, I expect them to cut it to one through sleeper past ATL rather than axing them all (both options make a certain amount of sense, but I suspect that Amtrak will ultimately be very hesitant not to offer some sort of ATL-NOL sleeper service lest they lose some sleeper pax to a forced second reservation on the leg)...but I could definitely see either option happening. I also wouldn't be shocked to see one or more coaches turned at ATL as well if they did this...it would make for an LSL-esque train in terms of the consist setup, but I definitely see something in this vein happening.

I could see a future situation, with the new Viewliner order coming online, where you have four sleepers to ATL (two from the present equipment allocation with turning, plus one from the new order pool) and only one to NOL. On the coaches, I'm not sure how radically different the demand situation is there, but I could also see 5 coaches NYP-ATL and 2-3 ATL-NOL (either keeping the equipment allocation the same or even transferring two coaches to a different part of the single-level system, such as the Cardinal).

In olden days, all sleepers were cut in Atlanta, and at least one coach for a time, I think.

 

[Anderson]

Honestly, I expect them to cut it to one through sleeper past ATL rather than axing them all (both options make a certain amount of sense, but I suspect that Amtrak will ultimately be very hesitant not to offer some sort of ATL-NOL sleeper service lest they lose some sleeper pax to a forced second reservation on the leg)...but I could definitely see either option happening. I also wouldn't be shocked to see one or more coaches turned at ATL as well if they did this...it would make for an LSL-esque train in terms of the consist setup, but I definitely see something in this vein happening.

I could see a future situation, with the new Viewliner order coming online, where you have four sleepers to ATL (two from the present equipment allocation with turning, plus one from the new order pool) and only one to NOL. On the coaches, I'm not sure how radically different the demand situation is there, but I could also see 5 coaches NYP-ATL and 2-3 ATL-NOL (either keeping the equipment allocation the same or even transferring two coaches to a different part of the single-level system, such as the Cardinal).

In olden days, all sleepers were cut in Atlanta, and at least one coach for a time, I think.

Honestly, looking at this more and more, if you're going to do this then I'd set things up as follows going into Atlanta:

Baggage/Dorm-Coach-Coach-Coach-Cafe-Coach-Diner-Sleeper-Sleeper-Sleeper-Sleeper

In Atlanta, I'd drop everything after the cafe and add a 2-1 BC car for through sleepers, so you'd get:

Baggage/Dorm-Coach-Coach-Coach-Cafe-Business

I hate cutting the diner, but what I would do is stick the two freed-up diners on the Cardinal (assuming no net increase of equipment). I would make sure that the Crescent always got 48-seat diners. Of course, if the equipment situation for some reason allowed a fifth sleeper down the road (assuming the whole 25 sleeper order comes on and nothing has to retire, this would be an outside shot...I think there are about six other trains that would take precedence for added sleepers: LSL, SM, SS, a revived SP, a daily Cardinal, and the Twilight Shoreliner), you might be forced to either do a double diner, do some seating in the cafe, or promote in-cabin meal service.

 

[abcnews]

I think the plan is in place to add a NYP - ATL Viewliner sleeper (soon). That would make the Crescent and the Meteor to have the same consists (3 sleepers each). Then drop one sleeper in Atlanta, and keep the other two as it is now.

BTW - My son and daughter just took this train - departing New Orleans in the height of Tropical Storm Lee - on this past Friday morning. They were able to watch the RR workers and/or city officials as they shut the locks on the main levee, as the train slowly passed through the lock. At that point, the Saturday train had already been cancelled and the streets were being overrun with water. They were literally the "last train to the coast"... albeit the Atlantic coast (referring to the Don McLean song)

Anyway - they had 5 coaches and a full load. The train had been sold out for a week or so. And because of that - they had 6 people in the Diner. My son and daughter were so impressed. They had never seen a diner at top efficiency - as it was on this trip. In fact, I was told that the dinning car crew made several announcements to entice folks to visit the diner - for breakfast, and again for lunch ("You all come on down") And everyone moved in and out quickly. Apparently - because of the 5th coach, Amtrak had arranged for an extra dinning car cook, plus the train crew sent an additional onboard Amtrak trainee (newly hired) up to the dinning car to help. And they also took the coach attendant from the 5th coach, and assigned him to the diner. The combined force was 6 - included two cooks. The primary cook - a woman from NY (I think) was a big hit. She went though the sleepers and introduced herself - recommended certain dishes and she made (or arranged for ) an amazing peanut butter and chocolate pie.

*Also it was a brand new refurbished Northern Pacific diner (#8504), that was just amazing. They said it had new colors and decor like it had just left the factory. It was quite an experience for them - especially with the large crew in the ding car. They were returning from an around the country trip - and this was their best ride by far. Yet they had anticipated it to be the worst segmant, since it was their only single level train segment (NOL - WAS).

 

[me_little_me]

Cutting the sleepers out in Atlanta would require that they be maintained and stored there and switching be done to add them on. Not an easy thing at Brookwood. Amtrak gets little mileage out of that because they are not reused but just dropped and left.

Given that they are going to make the effort to do switching, better might be to run a split train - NYC to NOL and NYC to FLA via ATL and have the sleepers go to Florida. Then there will be an economic gain as they can get revenue.

In either case, it will probably take a new Atlanta station to do this.

 

[GaSteve]

Cutting the sleepers out in Atlanta would require that they be maintained and stored there and switching be done to add them on. Not an easy thing at Brookwood. Amtrak gets little mileage out of that because they are not reused but just dropped and left.

Given that they are going to make the effort to do switching, better might be to run a split train - NYC to NOL and NYC to FLA via ATL and have the sleepers go to Florida. Then there will be an economic gain as they can get revenue.

In either case, it will probably take a new Atlanta station to do this.

When they split the train before, they took the sleepers to Armour yard to service and store them and brought them back to Brookwood.

 

[abcnews]

BTW - I heard that new service may be coming your way....

Atlanta to Savannah, GA

I think it will be daily service.

 

[GaSteve]

BTW - I heard that new service may be coming your way....

Atlanta to Savannah, GA

I think it will be daily service.

40 years ago.

 

[abcnews]

Actually, I think it will soon be announced.... Amtrak service (with a train) from Atlanta to Savannah.

 

[eagle628]

Actually, I think it will soon be announced.... Amtrak service (with a train) from Atlanta to Savannah.

And...why has no one else heard anything about this, why have there been no studies, no EIS's done, no funding battles, no equipment problems?

 

[abcnews]

Maybe I have it wrong, or maybe they are just considering it at this point.

But I think that they will be looking closely at Atlanta to Savannah. Keep in mind, they recently announced new service up here for Petersburg to Norfolk on the NS mainline. They are already in the construction phase on that one with plans to add a NY to Norfolk train via Richmond and Petersburg, VA. I think Atlanta to Savannah may be next.

I guess, we will soon find out if it is indeed the case..

 

[GaSteve]

Maybe I have it wrong, or maybe they are just considering it at this point.

But I think that they will be looking closely at Atlanta to Savannah. Keep in mind, they recently announced new service up here for Petersburg to Norfolk on the NS mainline. They are already in the construction phase on that one with plans to add a NY to Norfolk train via Richmond and Petersburg, VA. I think Atlanta to Savannah may be next.

I guess, we will soon find out if it is indeed the case..

It's "been considered" for the past 30 years. Right now, NS has no available capacity on one Atlanta-Macon line and the other needs $100M in improvements to bring up to passenger standards, including signalling (most of it is dark right now). Likewise, Macon-Savannah is not up to passenger standards. And, significant track reconfiguration would be required in Macon.

I wouldn't buy a ticket yet..... :unsure:

 

[abcnews]

I did hear this from a reliable source - so my guess would be that they are hopeful to work in one train a day - each way, on the busy NS mainline.

 

[rrdude]

Oh how many "reliable sources" have we all heard espousing the next addition of new Amtrak service..........

I'm sorry if I sound jaded, but I guess years of experience, does that to one.

OTH, I hope you are correct.

 

[Anderson]

Cutting the sleepers out in Atlanta would require that they be maintained and stored there and switching be done to add them on. Not an easy thing at Brookwood. Amtrak gets little mileage out of that because they are not reused but just dropped and left.

Given that they are going to make the effort to do switching, better might be to run a split train - NYC to NOL and NYC to FLA via ATL and have the sleepers go to Florida. Then there will be an economic gain as they can get revenue.

In either case, it will probably take a new Atlanta station to do this.

They're not "dropped and left"; they're turned around and sent our that evening. Remember, there are four Crescent consists...in general, you've got two on each side of Atlanta at any given time. Let's say that you've got equipment sets A, B, C, and D. Currently, A leaves NYP on day 1, arrives in ATL on the morning of day 2, arrives in NOL late on day 2, leaves NOL on day 3, arrives back in ATL on the evening of day 3, and arrives in NYP again on day 4. B does this on days 2-5, C on days 3-6, and D on days 4-7.

What would happen is that B would drop its sleepers on the morning of day 3 and A would pick them up that evening heading back north. C would drop its sleepers and B would pick them up. D would drop its sleepers and C would pick them up. A would drop its sleepers and D would pick them up...and so on. The cars would be in ATL for about 12 hours, not 2-3 days.

On new services: I think Amtrak is going to settle on a service option in the PIP, but it'll take a few years to make happen. As it is, the RVR-Norfolk service was announced, but it has about a two-year implementation period on the heels of a slab of EISes (which do make for an interesting read in some parts, though I must confess that the actual "environmental" parts bore me to death). These things tend to take forever to make happen because of all of the agreements which need to happen to make the services actually come about. Thus, even if Amtrak announced tomorrow that it was running a train ATL-SAV, you probably wouldn't see it until 2014 (late 2013 if a bunch of GA politicians were twisting arms with the RRs and were bound and determined to make it happen in a hurry). An extra train on an existing route is a bit easier.

And on running the Crescent ATL-SAV...I'm wondering what that timetable would look like, at least as far as how long it would take to get to SAV. Depending on the time, you might end up with a bad set of Florida times (I'm thinking early, early morning for Orlando) unless you hold the train in ATL for a few hours.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Cutting the sleepers out in Atlanta would require that they be maintained and stored there and switching be done to add them on. Not an easy thing at Brookwood. Amtrak gets little mileage out of that because they are not reused but just dropped and left.

Given that they are going to make the effort to do switching, better might be to run a split train - NYC to NOL and NYC to FLA via ATL and have the sleepers go to Florida. Then there will be an economic gain as they can get revenue.

In either case, it will probably take a new Atlanta station to do this.

They're not "dropped and left"; they're turned around and sent our that evening. Remember, there are four Crescent consists...in general, you've got two on each side of Atlanta at any given time. Let's say that you've got equipment sets A, B, C, and D. Currently, A leaves NYP on day 1, arrives in ATL on the morning of day 2, arrives in NOL late on day 2, leaves NOL on day 3, arrives back in ATL on the evening of day 3, and arrives in NYP again on day 4. B does this on days 2-5, C on days 3-6, and D on days 4-7.

What would happen is that B would drop its sleepers on the morning of day 3 and A would pick them up that evening heading back north. C would drop its sleepers and B would pick them up. D would drop its sleepers and C would pick them up. A would drop its sleepers and D would pick them up...and so on. The cars would be in ATL for about 12 hours, not 2-3 days.

On new services: I think Amtrak is going to settle on a service option in the PIP, but it'll take a few years to make happen. As it is, the RVR-Norfolk service was announced, but it has about a two-year implementation period on the heels of a slab of EISes (which do make for an interesting read in some parts, though I must confess that the actual "environmental" parts bore me to death). These things tend to take forever to make happen because of all of the agreements which need to happen to make the services actually come about. Thus, even if Amtrak announced tomorrow that it was running a train ATL-SAV, you probably wouldn't see it until 2014 (late 2013 if a bunch of GA politicians were twisting arms with the RRs and were bound and determined to make it happen in a hurry). An extra train on an existing route is a bit easier.

And on running the Crescent ATL-SAV...I'm wondering what that timetable would look like, at least as far as how long it would take to get to SAV. Depending on the time, you might end up with a bad set of Florida times (I'm thinking early, early morning for Orlando) unless you hold the train in ATL for a few hours.

As an eyewitness (countless times),I can say that Anderson is correct about how the New York to Atlanta cars were handled in the past. What would arrive in Atlanta Monday morning did go back monday night.

 

[dlagrua]

We were on the Crecent this past June. The coaches thinned out but the sleepers were at least 50-75% full going to NOL past Atlanta. Ride the train during Mardi Gras months and it will be full.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Cutting the sleepers out in Atlanta would require that they be maintained and stored there and switching be done to add them on. Not an easy thing at Brookwood. Amtrak gets little mileage out of that because they are not reused but just dropped and left.

Given that they are going to make the effort to do switching, better might be to run a split train - NYC to NOL and NYC to FLA via ATL and have the sleepers go to Florida. Then there will be an economic gain as they can get revenue.

In either case, it will probably take a new Atlanta station to do this.

They're not "dropped and left"; they're turned around and sent our that evening. Remember, there are four Crescent consists...in general, you've got two on each side of Atlanta at any given time. Let's say that you've got equipment sets A, B, C, and D. Currently, A leaves NYP on day 1, arrives in ATL on the morning of day 2, arrives in NOL late on day 2, leaves NOL on day 3, arrives back in ATL on the evening of day 3, and arrives in NYP again on day 4. B does this on days 2-5, C on days 3-6, and D on days 4-7.

What would happen is that B would drop its sleepers on the morning of day 3 and A would pick them up that evening heading back north. C would drop its sleepers and B would pick them up. D would drop its sleepers and C would pick them up. A would drop its sleepers and D would pick them up...and so on. The cars would be in ATL for about 12 hours, not 2-3 days.

On new services: I think Amtrak is going to settle on a service option in the PIP, but it'll take a few years to make happen. As it is, the RVR-Norfolk service was announced, but it has about a two-year implementation period on the heels of a slab of EISes (which do make for an interesting read in some parts, though I must confess that the actual "environmental" parts bore me to death). These things tend to take forever to make happen because of all of the agreements which need to happen to make the services actually come about. Thus, even if Amtrak announced tomorrow that it was running a train ATL-SAV, you probably wouldn't see it until 2014 (late 2013 if a bunch of GA politicians were twisting arms with the RRs and were bound and determined to make it happen in a hurry). An extra train on an existing route is a bit easier.

And on running the Crescent ATL-SAV...I'm wondering what that timetable would look like, at least as far as how long it would take to get to SAV. Depending on the time, you might end up with a bad set of Florida times (I'm thinking early, early morning for Orlando) unless you hold the train in ATL for a few hours.

As an eyewitness (countless times),I can say that Anderson is correct about how the New York to Atlanta cars were handled in the past. What would arrive in Atlanta Monday morning did go back monday night.

I just made an important correction to my earlier post. What arrived on Monday went back on Monday Somehow I typed that it went back on Wednesday which contradicts the whole point. Wonder what I smoked or drank for breakfast?

 

[GaSteve]

Cutting the sleepers out in Atlanta would require that they be maintained and stored there and switching be done to add them on. Not an easy thing at Brookwood. Amtrak gets little mileage out of that because they are not reused but just dropped and left.

Given that they are going to make the effort to do switching, better might be to run a split train - NYC to NOL and NYC to FLA via ATL and have the sleepers go to Florida. Then there will be an economic gain as they can get revenue.

In either case, it will probably take a new Atlanta station to do this.

They're not "dropped and left"; they're turned around and sent our that evening. Remember, there are four Crescent consists...in general, you've got two on each side of Atlanta at any given time. Let's say that you've got equipment sets A, B, C, and D. Currently, A leaves NYP on day 1, arrives in ATL on the morning of day 2, arrives in NOL late on day 2, leaves NOL on day 3, arrives back in ATL on the evening of day 3, and arrives in NYP again on day 4. B does this on days 2-5, C on days 3-6, and D on days 4-7.

What would happen is that B would drop its sleepers on the morning of day 3 and A would pick them up that evening heading back north. C would drop its sleepers and B would pick them up. D would drop its sleepers and C would pick them up. A would drop its sleepers and D would pick them up...and so on. The cars would be in ATL for about 12 hours, not 2-3 days.

On new services: I think Amtrak is going to settle on a service option in the PIP, but it'll take a few years to make happen. As it is, the RVR-Norfolk service was announced, but it has about a two-year implementation period on the heels of a slab of EISes (which do make for an interesting read in some parts, though I must confess that the actual "environmental" parts bore me to death). These things tend to take forever to make happen because of all of the agreements which need to happen to make the services actually come about. Thus, even if Amtrak announced tomorrow that it was running a train ATL-SAV, you probably wouldn't see it until 2014 (late 2013 if a bunch of GA politicians were twisting arms with the RRs and were bound and determined to make it happen in a hurry). An extra train on an existing route is a bit easier.

And on running the Crescent ATL-SAV...I'm wondering what that timetable would look like, at least as far as how long it would take to get to SAV. Depending on the time, you might end up with a bad set of Florida times (I'm thinking early, early morning for Orlando) unless you hold the train in ATL for a few hours.

As an eyewitness (countless times),I can say that Anderson is correct about how the New York to Atlanta cars were handled in the past. What would arrive in Atlanta Monday morning did go back monday night.

I just made an important correction to my earlier post. What arrived on Monday went back on Monday Somehow I typed that it went back on Wednesday which contradicts the whole point. Wonder what I smoked or drank for breakfast?

Having seen the operation myself many times, I wondered what you were thinking. I'll have what you're having. :wacko:

 

[Anderson]

Cutting the sleepers out in Atlanta would require that they be maintained and stored there and switching be done to add them on. Not an easy thing at Brookwood. Amtrak gets little mileage out of that because they are not reused but just dropped and left.

Given that they are going to make the effort to do switching, better might be to run a split train - NYC to NOL and NYC to FLA via ATL and have the sleepers go to Florida. Then there will be an economic gain as they can get revenue.

In either case, it will probably take a new Atlanta station to do this.

They're not "dropped and left"; they're turned around and sent our that evening. Remember, there are four Crescent consists...in general, you've got two on each side of Atlanta at any given time. Let's say that you've got equipment sets A, B, C, and D. Currently, A leaves NYP on day 1, arrives in ATL on the morning of day 2, arrives in NOL late on day 2, leaves NOL on day 3, arrives back in ATL on the evening of day 3, and arrives in NYP again on day 4. B does this on days 2-5, C on days 3-6, and D on days 4-7.

What would happen is that B would drop its sleepers on the morning of day 3 and A would pick them up that evening heading back north. C would drop its sleepers and B would pick them up. D would drop its sleepers and C would pick them up. A would drop its sleepers and D would pick them up...and so on. The cars would be in ATL for about 12 hours, not 2-3 days.

On new services: I think Amtrak is going to settle on a service option in the PIP, but it'll take a few years to make happen. As it is, the RVR-Norfolk service was announced, but it has about a two-year implementation period on the heels of a slab of EISes (which do make for an interesting read in some parts, though I must confess that the actual "environmental" parts bore me to death). These things tend to take forever to make happen because of all of the agreements which need to happen to make the services actually come about. Thus, even if Amtrak announced tomorrow that it was running a train ATL-SAV, you probably wouldn't see it until 2014 (late 2013 if a bunch of GA politicians were twisting arms with the RRs and were bound and determined to make it happen in a hurry). An extra train on an existing route is a bit easier.

And on running the Crescent ATL-SAV...I'm wondering what that timetable would look like, at least as far as how long it would take to get to SAV. Depending on the time, you might end up with a bad set of Florida times (I'm thinking early, early morning for Orlando) unless you hold the train in ATL for a few hours.

As an eyewitness (countless times),I can say that Anderson is correct about how the New York to Atlanta cars were handled in the past. What would arrive in Atlanta Monday morning did go back monday night.

I just made an important correction to my earlier post. What arrived on Monday went back on Monday Somehow I typed that it went back on Wednesday which contradicts the whole point. Wonder what I smoked or drank for breakfast?

Having seen the operation myself many times, I wondered what you were thinking. I'll have what you're having. :wacko:

I'll have what they're having as well!