Timetable error!!! Wow.

[wayman]

This just gets crazier and crazier.

Saturday, we arrive in Portland, find out we can't take 28(1), and spend some time in the Metropolitan Lounge assessing our options. I go to amtrak.com, click the Timetables, and download the relevant ones to my laptop. The new Coast Starlight timetable was up (effective 2 Jan 2011), so I downloaded it.

It shows new schedules for 11 and 14. The new schedule for 11 has it arriving in Portland (from Seattle) at 3:50pm, and departing for points south at 4:25pm. It says "Effective January 2, 2011" clearly at the top.

The Portland station folks rebooked us onto 11(2) and gave us a hotel room.

We got to the station at 3:00pm today, to find out that 11(2) ran on the old Effective November 8, 2010 timetable -- which is to say, it was long gone :blink:

I showed the Portland station crew the PDF of the new CS timetable, and they were stunned. Portland has not yet received printed copies of the new timetable, so this was the first they'd seen it, and the first instance where anyone had pointed out the error.

The Portland stationmaster said his best guess is that Amtrak meant for "Effective January 2, 2011" to apply to trainsets originating from Los Angeles, which, when they reach Seattle and start coming southbound again, will run on the new timetable. He absolutely agrees that the timetable as available on the website is a horrific error and that Amtrak should offer compensation.

So now there was no way for Amtrak to even get us to the flight we'd already booked from San Jose to Boston (which would've gotten us home on our desired schedule, but relied upon us taking 11(2), for which we got to the station in plenty of time according to the timetable...).

Unfortunately, responsibilities compel us to be home by Tuesday evening, and there's really no way to even come close to that on Amtrak given that 11(3) is booked solid, 28(3) is booked solid, 8(3) is booked solid. We'd be two days late at best given our available options by rail.

The Portland station crew gave me a printed copy of our reservation showing the note that we cut short our travel and should receive a refund of Guest Reward points. (I'm assuming that I will get 25,000 back -- we'd booked a 35,000 reward, and only took a one-zone trip before annulments and printing errors forced us to abandon Amtrak.)

We're canceling the SJC-BOS flight (after a $100/person cancellation fee, we get the balance in credit for future JetBlue travel... moderately useless) and rebooking on Continental for PDX-BOS leaving tonight. We'll get dinner at Wilf's (we're still at Portland Union Station, comfy with free wi-fi) and then take MAX to the "other PDX" (airport).

I'm going to try signing up for the Continental Onepass before booking the Continental flight -- I can transfer my Onepass points to AGR and make some lemonade from lemons, right?

And we'll save all our receipts -- booking and canceling the JetBlue flight, booking the Continental flight, etc. (And yes, I have a copy of the timetable saved to my hard drive. And I've also checked their website, and the timetable is the same, with no note whatsoever that the "Effective January 2, 2011" timetable does not apply to 11(2) from Seattle.

Once we're home, I'll write a letter to Amtrak -- to express our understanding about 28(1) being canceled, our appreciation for the stellar service of the Portland station crew in their efforts to re-accommodate us, and our extreme disappointment in the timetable error, providing a detailed account of our trip and a copy of all expenses we incurred and requesting remuneration for the latter.

I'll also call AGR and make sure my account gets properly credited.

Any of you have a sense for how Amtrak and AGR will respond?

Should I request any specific level of remuneration from Amtrak? "All expenses, as per the following copies of receipts"? "All expenses, plus we would appreciate additional consideration for the great deal of frustration we went through as a result of the timetable error -- in the form of a voucher for future travels"? Or just describe the situation, make no specific request, and see what they offer?

Should I expect AGR to give me trouble? (I'm guessing nobody has a clue here with AGR having just switched over its entire staff.)

In the end, all I can say is ... wow. For about half an hour, I was feeling as stupid as I can remember ever feeling -- I thought I'd misread the timetable and this was all my fault. Then I thought "I just have to look at it again -- I won't be able to feel better about this until I actually see and acknowledge my error" and ... I saw it was in fact Amtrak's error. Now, I'm pretty mellow. This will all work out somehow. Most of the people I've dealt with have been great.

But ... wow.

 

[Steve4031]

Ouch. That is awful. To have that happen after the other challenges would be pretty disheartening. I don't know how Amtrak would respond to this. What did your ticket say? They might try to say that you should have gone by the time printed on your ticket.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

Wow, Will. Was anyone else caught by it?

 

[wayman]

Ouch. That is awful. To have that happen after the other challenges would be pretty disheartening. I don't know how Amtrak would respond to this. What did your ticket say? They might try to say that you should have gone by the time printed on your ticket.

I'll never know what the ticket for 11(2) said as it was never printed.

I called the Portland stationmaster this morning, spoke to him directly, and he said he'd take care of our booking. I showed up at the station, went to the ticket counter (and got the same agent who was very helpful to us when the Starlight arrived yesterday), told him the arrangements had been made per the stationmaster and asked him to print my ticket, and he got this worried look on his face and said, "well, yes, the arrangements were made, but there's one problem ... the train has left the station".

 

[Steve4031]

Well then you went by the information that was published by Amtrak, and that would not be your fault. I hope this works out for you. Boy it really stinks when you are diligent, and get screwed for being on top of things. Dang!!.

 

[Trogdor]

You should always go with what your reservation says (had you verified it/printed your tickets, you would have seen the correct time). Printed timetables are subject to change/error, and the information contained within them is not guaranteed. In fact, the bottom of every timetable does say "subject to change without notice."

The first southbound Starlight with the modified schedule departs tomorrow. Numerous internal notices were distributed to employees with that information, and passengers affected were called and told their new reservation times. Anybody who booked after the schedule change was uploaded would already see the new times and thus would not need notification.

Perhaps some note should have been added that says "effective January 3 southbound." That might have helped.

What's done is done. But I would let this be a lesson to others, go with what your reservation says, not what the timetable says.

 

[Anderson]

This is why I always run to the local station the night before I'm supposed to catch a train: I pick up my tickets and check the times and whatnot to make sure I haven't borked the reservation somehow. Granted, I can do this with ease because my station is close to my house, but it's still a good precaution.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

I'll never know what the ticket for 11(2) said as it was never printed.

I'll have to echo Steve, then what did your reservation say for the times? When was the last time you checked those reservations?

From my experience, if the train's schedule changes, those changes will be reflected back into your reservations. And if substantial changes happen, my online reservation will also direct me to call Amtrak.

 

[AlanB]

You should always go with what your reservation says (had you verified it/printed your tickets, you would have seen the correct time). Printed timetables are subject to change/error, and the information contained within them is not guaranteed. In fact, the bottom of every timetable does say "subject to change without notice."

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at. He was originally connecting to the Empire Builder the day before, which got cancelled. His reservations were in a state of flux as the Amtrak personel in Portland worked with him to get him to his destination, after putting him up in a hotel for the night.

After searching out all the options, he choose to ride back to Cali, catch a flight to the east and then the LSL from Boston to his destination. The agents in Portland setup the Amtrak stuff for him, while he did the airline reservation.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at.

Printed or not, he must have had a reservation, no?

IMHO, the time stated in the reservation should have been the final word; not some schedule or some one's word.

 

[Steve4031]

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at.

Printed or not, he must have had a reservation, no?

IMHO, the time stated in the reservation should have been the final word; not some schedule or some one's word.

Take it easy on the guy. He had tons of stuff going on, and probably never got a print out of the new reservation because the station manager was helping him out. I could see myself making an error like that with tons of stuff going on. When I travel with my GF, at times we get caught up in trying to do too much, and I have made some rookie mistakes while traveling with her.

 

[wayman]

You should always go with what your reservation says (had you verified it/printed your tickets, you would have seen the correct time). Printed timetables are subject to change/error, and the information contained within them is not guaranteed. In fact, the bottom of every timetable does say "subject to change without notice."

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at. He was originally connecting to the Empire Builder the day before, which got cancelled. His reservations were in a state of flux as the Amtrak personel in Portland worked with him to get him to his destination, after putting him up in a hotel for the night.

After searching out all the options, he choose to ride back to Cali, catch a flight to the east and then the LSL from Boston to his destination. The agents in Portland setup the Amtrak stuff for him, while he did the airline reservation.

Alan's got it right. I'll just add that throughout, I followed the directions of Amtrak personnel. The helpful station agent gave me a direct phone number to discuss options; when we made our selection, he asked me to call the stationmaster, with top authority, since this reservation had the added complexity of involving AGR. I called the stationmaster at 7:30am, he knew the details already, I asked if he could re-arrange everything, and he said yes, and a moment later said I was all set -- just show up and ask for the agent I'd dealt with in person or for the stationmaster himself. At no time did I have a printout. This was all handled through direct calls with station personnel in a very unusual set of circumstances under tight time constraints. Portland, unlike Chicago, doesn't have dedicated staff to handle "distressed passengers" needing rebookings when travel gets interrupted and connections get missed. In Portland, that job is also handled by the ticket agents and stationmaster. They did a great job. All I did carefully followed their directions and the most current information provided by Amtrak to the general public. Unfortunately, that information was wrong.

 

[D T Nelson]

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at.

Printed or not, he must have had a reservation, no?

IMHO, the time stated in the reservation should have been the final word; not some schedule or some one's word.

I made a reservation yesterday (January 1) for travel on the Coast Starlight in June. The departure and arrival times quoted when I made the reservation, and in the reservation confirmation email from Amtrak, were the old timetable times. I just looked at my reservation on Amtrak.com and it still shows the old times. So I suspect my reservation is not the final word.

I don't keep up on the timetable changes, if I hadn't read this thread I would not know that my train is going to leave two hours later.

 

[wayman]

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at.

Printed or not, he must have had a reservation, no?

IMHO, the time stated in the reservation should have been the final word; not some schedule or some one's word.

I made a reservation yesterday (January 1) for travel on the Coast Starlight in June. The departure and arrival times quoted when I made the reservation, and in the reservation confirmation email from Amtrak, were the old timetable times. I just looked at my reservation on Amtrak.com and it still shows the old times. So I suspect my reservation is not the final word.

I don't keep up on the timetable changes, if I hadn't read this thread I would not know that my train is going to leave two hours later.

No, your reservation is correct. This change is only for a few months, necessitated by Union Pacific trackwork along the route. By June the CS will be back to the old schedule.

 

[boxcar479]

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at.

Printed or not, he must have had a reservation, no?

IMHO, the time stated in the reservation should have been the final word; not some schedule or some one's word.

I made a reservation yesterday (January 1) for travel on the Coast Starlight in June. The departure and arrival times quoted when I made the reservation, and in the reservation confirmation email from Amtrak, were the old timetable times. I just looked at my reservation on Amtrak.com and it still shows the old times. So I suspect my reservation is not the final word.

I don't keep up on the timetable changes, if I hadn't read this thread I would not know that my train is going to leave two hours later.

No, your reservation is correct. This change is only for a few months, necessitated by Union Pacific trackwork along the route. By June the CS will be back to the old schedule.

And we are supposed to believe you??? just kidding I am sorry about your travel woes. I'm glad you are taking it so well though. I hope you get compensated for "circumstances beyond your control"

 

[D T Nelson]

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at.

Printed or not, he must have had a reservation, no?

IMHO, the time stated in the reservation should have been the final word; not some schedule or some one's word.

I made a reservation yesterday (January 1) for travel on the Coast Starlight in June. The departure and arrival times quoted when I made the reservation, and in the reservation confirmation email from Amtrak, were the old timetable times. I just looked at my reservation on Amtrak.com and it still shows the old times. So I suspect my reservation is not the final word.

I don't keep up on the timetable changes, if I hadn't read this thread I would not know that my train is going to leave two hours later.

No, your reservation is correct. This change is only for a few months, necessitated by Union Pacific trackwork along the route. By June the CS will be back to the old schedule.

Thank you for clarifying that for me. (Nonetheless, I'll keep an eye on the timetable as my trip draws closer.)

 

[wayman]

Alas, in his case he had no printed reservation or tickets to look at.

Printed or not, he must have had a reservation, no?

IMHO, the time stated in the reservation should have been the final word; not some schedule or some one's word.

I made a reservation yesterday (January 1) for travel on the Coast Starlight in June. The departure and arrival times quoted when I made the reservation, and in the reservation confirmation email from Amtrak, were the old timetable times. I just looked at my reservation on Amtrak.com and it still shows the old times. So I suspect my reservation is not the final word.

I don't keep up on the timetable changes, if I hadn't read this thread I would not know that my train is going to leave two hours later.

No, your reservation is correct. This change is only for a few months, necessitated by Union Pacific trackwork along the route. By June the CS will be back to the old schedule.

Thank you for clarifying that for me. (Nonetheless, I'll keep an eye on the timetable as my trip draws closer.)

Always a good idea to keep checking -- trackwork could take longer than UP predicts it will. Not a bad idea to check by phone as a double-check either!

 

[wayman]

Wow, Will. Was anyone else caught by it?

Not that I know of. I know one other couple originally on 14(31)-28(1) rebooked onto 28(3) in hopes it would run. (That's guest_kim) I don't know what other connecting passengers did, but I think we may well have been the only ones to select an alternate route on 11(2). Anyone else traveling on 11(2) presumably had a nice normal reservation and ticket and, also, may never have gone looking for the timetable in the past few days online, either.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

I have caught a couple of errors in the timetables through the years. However, it never involved actual reservations and tickets (for me,that is).

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around this situation. On the one hand you seem to be really on top of things checking for last minute timetable changes and such. Normally this would be the sign of an experienced and proactive traveler. On the other hand you seem awfully indifferent about your lack of any official record of the actual changes being made and the resulting new schedule. I'll admit that I don't check for last minute schedule changes but every single time there is any sort of change being made by anyone to my schedule I always ask for a document/email/recap at the end to ensure I have the most recent information at that time. I don't disagree that any schedule changes should be made as clear as possible online, but considering that the schedules did show a change why didn't you request a recap by phone/email/document as soon as you noticed this?

 

[user 3575]

This is sort of "neither here nor there," but I could (almost) swear that our Station Hosts were told to expect 11 to kick in the new schedule at SJC (day 2 of the trip) on the 3rd, which would make the first run on the new schedule 11(2). But I see via Amtrak Status Maps that 11(2) is running on the old schedule, leaving Seattle on time at 9:45 a.m. (The new schedule, for *some* time in January - March, has 11 and 14 leaving Seattle and Los Angeles 2 hours later, and keeping +2 hours throughout the run.

 

[wayman]

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around this situation. On the one hand you seem to be really on top of things checking for last minute timetable changes and such. Normally this would be the sign of an experienced and proactive traveler. On the other hand you seem awfully indifferent about your lack of any official record of the actual changes being made and the resulting new schedule. I'll admit that I don't check for last minute schedule changes but every single time there is any sort of change being made by anyone to my schedule I always ask for a document/email/recap at the end to ensure I have the most recent information at that time. I don't disagree that any schedule changes should be made as clear as possible online, but considering that the schedules did show a change why didn't you request a recap by phone/email/document as soon as you noticed this?

As soon as I noticed what?

With the stationmaster, on the phone, I got a full verbal confirmation that I had a bedroom A from PDX to SJC on 11(2) and a bedroom H from BOS-SPG on 448(4).

I had looked at the timetable that said it would be in effect the day before, when it became the timetable provided at Amtrak.com with a big note saying effective Jan 2, use this new one.

I don't see why I should have had any reason to question why the timetable Amtrak said was in effect would actually be in effect.

Unfortunately, the Portland station crew had no idea a printed or online version of the printed new schedule had been distributed. They had no clue I might have access to an alternate official timetable, much less one with incorrect information.

So, for both me and for the stationmaster, the confirmation of my booking on 11(2) included all important information. We just each had different underlying assumptions about what information the other person had or didn't have, and I think each of our assumptions was totally justified.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

As soon as I noticed what?

As soon as you noticed that there was a new schedule being implemented shortly before your trip.

I don't see why I should have had any reason to question why the timetable Amtrak said was in effect would actually be in effect.

I'm tempted to say because it's Amtrak but really I'd do this with airlines as well. This is more about simply being your own advocate than figuring out who to fault and why. If you or someone else makes a change to your itinerary then always ask for a full recap at the end. If you don't think of it at the time the changes are being made you can always call the reservations desk later and have them read it to you and/or email it to you. Your reservation will have precedence over the train's target timetable, even if you never ask for a record of it.

 

[AlanB]

As soon as I noticed what?

As soon as you noticed that there was a new schedule being implemented shortly before your trip.

Dax,

I think your confusion is being caused by the fact that Wayman actually has two different topics on going here and you didn't make the connection.

When he left on his trip, his trip was LA to Portland on the Coast Starlight, connecting to the Empire Builder to Chicago, and then to the LSL to Springfield, Mass.

While on the first leg of his trip, BNSF had the melt down or perhaps I should say the freeze up, on their line. They forced Amtrak to cancel the Empire Builder run that Wayman would have transferred to when he reached Portland.

Amtrak put Wayman up in a hotel for the night, thinking that they'd get him on the next day's train, only to learn that BNSF was forcing them to cancel that train too.

Faced with needing to get to his destination, Amtrak pretty much offered to do whatever they could to help him out. After juggling prices and such, he found that he could fly from Sacramento to Boston rather cheaply. So Amtrak booked him on the southbound Coast Starlight back to Sacramento to catch that plane. When Wayman left home, he never thought in his wildest dreams that he'd be doubling back on the very same train. And therefore, he was not at all concerned with the schedule change. It wasn’t going to affect him at all; had his trip gone as planned.

It was only because of all of those last minute adjustments to his trip, while already in the middle of his trip and stranded in Portland basically, that this schedule situation arose. And while I suspect that regular station agents do have a way just like phone agent to email a reservation, it's highly unlikely that they do it very often and actually know how to do it. After all, normally when they make a reservation for someone, they print out the tickets right then and there.

It was only the special circumstance, with Wayman sitting at his hotel trying to figure out how best to get where he needed to go, that cause the station agent to essentially act like a phone agent and make the reservation without issuing the tickets. It's unlikely that it even occurred to him to email a reservation, even if he could under these special circumstances.

I hope that this makes things clearer for you.

 

[Bierboy]

This is why I always run to the local station the night before I'm supposed to catch a train: I pick up my tickets and check the times and whatnot to make sure I haven't borked the reservation somehow. Granted, I can do this with ease because my station is close to my house, but it's still a good precaution.

Heck, I NEVER wait until the day of, or a day or two before, my trip. I ALWAYS pick up my tickets and confirm everything a month or two out. I just did that Saturday with a trip we're taking in March on the EB. We won the trip in a ClearChannel radio contest and upgraded a roomette to a sleeper, so I wanted to make sure all was kosher. It was NOT; somehow the reservation had been canceled. Fortunately, there was still a sleeper available, so all is well. But I would not have wanted to discover that the day of the trip; plus there would have been a much greater likelihood that a sleeper wouldn't be available the day of the trip.