New Viewliner II's

[TWA904]

Instead of using all the new Viewliner II's as replacement for the aging equipment, I believe a few

should be to add one peice of equipment to existing long distance trains to increase capacity

and then place another order for more Viewliner equipment. What do you think.

 

[AlanB]

Instead of using all the new Viewliner II's as replacement for the aging equipment, I believe a few

should be to add one peice of equipment to existing long distance trains to increase capacity

and then place another order for more Viewliner equipment. What do you think.

The Viewliner II sleepers will indeed be used to increase capacity on selected long distance trains.

The Viewliner baggage cars are replacing baggage cars that are way too old and need to be retired.

The same is true with the Viewliner dining cars, they're replacing cars that need to be retired.

 

[zephyr17]

Instead of using all the new Viewliner II's as replacement for the aging equipment, I believe a few

should be to add one peice of equipment to existing long distance trains to increase capacity

and then place another order for more Viewliner equipment. What do you think.

With regard to sleepers, that is indeed the plan, to provide more capacity and more protection.

With regard to the diners and the baggage cars, the plan is not to supplement but replace existing Heritage equipment. The heritage diners and baggage cars are the last of the railroad-inherited equipment (except for the PPCs and the Ocean View) still in regular service. The newest of those are about 55 years old. Amtrak wants to retire them as soon as they can.

However, even that will serve to improve capacity, as the dorm in the new baggage/dorms will free up space in the sleepers for revenue passengers instead of space being needed for crew members.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Instead of using all the new Viewliner II's as replacement for the aging equipment, I believe a few

should be to add one peice of equipment to existing long distance trains to increase capacity

and then place another order for more Viewliner equipment. What do you think.

With regard to sleepers, that is indeed the plan, to provide more capacity and more protection.

With regard to the diners and the baggage cars, the plan is not to supplement but replace existing Heritage equipment. The heritage diners and baggage cars are the last of the railroad-inherited equipment (except for the PPCs and the Ocean View) still in regular service. The newest of those are about 55 years old. Amtrak wants to retire them as soon as they can.

However, even that will serve to improve capacity, as the dorm in the new baggage/dorms will free up space in the sleepers for revenue passengers instead of space being needed for crew members.

I don't think Amtrak is in much need of more Diners and Baggage Cars anyway. They can just use the new cars to replace Heritage cars. But I really think they need more Sleepers, I think the NYP trains may need 100-125 Sleepers in total to answer demand.

 

[johnny.menhennet]

I don't think Matrak is in need of more Sleepers anyway.

But I really think they need more Sleepers

Will you please elaborate on your position here?

 

[PRR 60]

I don't think Matrak is in need of more Sleepers anyway.

But I really think they need more Sleepers

Will you please elaborate on your position here?

I think he's messing with our heads. It's working.

 

[Ryan]

Matrak doesn't need more sleepers, but Amtrak sure does.

At least that's what I think he's putting out.

 

[NE933]

I don't think Matrak is in need of more Sleepers anyway.

But I really think they need more Sleepers

Will you please elaborate on your position here?

I think he's messing with our heads. It's working.

If someone starts messing with a head that's been messed up already, there shall be results.

 

[TWA904]

I would like to the the entire system expand. Additional capacity should be added to current LD trains(and you say that will happen).

The SL needs to be restored to Orlando of Miami. I would re-route the SL up through Baton Rouge, even if I had to build new

track over to Lafayette, also re-route it to include Phoenix again. I beleive there needs to be a through train form Florida to Eastern

Canada. My entire work life has been spent in the transportation industry, so I believe I could build a profitable system.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I don't think Matrak is in need of more Sleepers anyway.

But I really think they need more Sleepers

Will you please elaborate on your position here?

I am extremly sorry, guys. I meant to say Amtrak and I meant Baggage Cars.

 

[Trogdor]

My entire work life has been spent in the transportation industry, so I believe I could build a profitable system.

There are lots of people whose entire life work has been in the transportation industry (and railroads in particular). What makes you think, specifically, that you could do a better job at running a profitable passenger rail system than any of the others that have tried?

 

[guest]

Instead of using all the new Viewliner II's as replacement for the aging equipment, I believe a few

should be to add one peice of equipment to existing long distance trains to increase capacity

and then place another order for more Viewliner equipment. What do you think.

With regard to sleepers, that is indeed the plan, to provide more capacity and more protection.

With regard to the diners and the baggage cars, the plan is not to supplement but replace existing Heritage equipment. The heritage diners and baggage cars are the last of the railroad-inherited equipment (except for the PPCs and the Ocean View) still in regular service. The newest of those are about 55 years old. Amtrak wants to retire them as soon as they can.

However, even that will serve to improve capacity, as the dorm in the new baggage/dorms will free up space in the sleepers for revenue passengers instead of space being needed for crew members.

I don't think Amtrak is in much need of more Diners and Baggage Cars anyway. They can just use the new cars to replace Heritage cars. But I really think they need more Sleepers, I think the NYP trains may need 100-125 Sleepers in total to answer demand.

Amtrak DESPERATELY needs more baggage cars. Most of the existing bag cars date to just after the Second World War...

 

[Ryan]

Nobody is saying that they don't need NEW baggage cars. He's saying they don't need to INCREASE the number of baggage cars.

I don't necessarily agree with that, but you're arguing against a position nobody has taken.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

I don't think Matrak is in need of more Sleepers anyway.

But I really think they need more Sleepers

Will you please elaborate on your position here?

I think he's messing with our heads. It's working.

And he's always saying he's confused!?!

 

[Notelvis]

I believe the plan is to cycle the existing Viewliner Sleepers through a renovation program once the new sleepers begin coming on line as well.

 

[jis]

I would like to the the entire system expand. Additional capacity should be added to current LD trains(and you say that will happen).

The SL needs to be restored to Orlando of Miami. I would re-route the SL up through Baton Rouge, even if I had to build new

track over to Lafayette, also re-route it to include Phoenix again. I beleive there needs to be a through train form Florida to Eastern

Canada. My entire work life has been spent in the transportation industry, so I believe I could build a profitable system.

... Let's start with where you are planning to get the money from to make your admittedly reasonable dreams come to fruition. Merely having worked in an industry is no guarantee for any success whotsoever

 

[transit54]

My entire work life has been spent in the transportation industry, so I believe I could build a profitable system.

Amtrak could be a profitable (no operating subsidy, only capital appropriations) system. However, Amtrak's current system cannot be run profitably. The only way to make Amtrak a profitable entity is to invest tens of billions of dollars and build the equivalent of several more Northeast Corridors (or true high speed rail) and then use any profit to cross-subsudize the operating costs for slower services. This is essentially what is done in Europe and some other parts of the world. The only way that Amtrak can generate an operating profit on its lines is being significantly more competitive time-wise than driving, and generally be able to compete with airlines in terms of overall trip time (i.e. considering the additional time to get to/from the airports, clear security, etc).

But ultimately, this plan involves investing a lot more money in passenger rail, albeit for capital rather than operating expenses.

 

[afigg]

I don't think Amtrak is in much need of more Diners and Baggage Cars anyway. They can just use the new cars to replace Heritage cars. But I really think they need more Sleepers, I think the NYP trains may need 100-125 Sleepers in total to answer demand.

Amtrak DESPERATELY needs more baggage cars. Most of the existing bag cars date to just after the Second World War...

Which is why Amtrak is replacing the baggage cars. The CAF 130 car order is for 55 baggage cars plus 25 baggage-dorm cars for a total of 80 baggage cars. The 55 baggage cars are enough to supply the western LD train fleet and the current eastern single level trains that have baggage cars (Carolinian, #66/#67, etc) but won't be getting baggage dorms.

For expansion such as adding baggage cars to a couple more Regionals making WAS-BOS runs and other trains, Amtrak may need to order some more baggage cars. There is an option for 70 cars total on the CAF order and we may see Amtrak exercise part of that option to get some more baggage and sleeper cars. A couple more baggage-dorm and diner cars would be nice as those would provide enough capacity plus a reserve for the restoration of the Three Rivers once additional LD coach cars are available.

 

[Blackwolf]

On the topic of baggage cars, needing more, and Amtrak seeming to have a crunch for baggage car space on some trains. If you look at just about any older footage of Amtrak trains before the Express Freight era, or look back in memory to the layout of consists, it seems (when Amtrak had a great many more baggage cars to draw from in their fleet pool) that many trains had two, even three baggage cars in their length. Obviously the company does not have enough cars to do this any more, and with the exception of combined trains like the LSL, everyone has to make-due with one car regardless of demand. Of course, one may wonder if we will see a regular coupling of full baggage and bag/dorm cars on trains with a lot of checked baggage demand (and I could foresee the Boston section of the LSL simply dropping to only a bag/dorm) once the VLII's arrive en-mass.

 

[transit54]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Amtrak indicate that once the Viewliner II order is completed they may add a sleeper back to 66/67?

 

[Gratt]

Just wondering, how much time does Amtrak have to exercise some or all of the extra “option.” And has anyone heard any talk if they are planning to do so.

 

[jis]

They first need to figure out how exxactly to pay for what they have on order. Then if they have some money left they can consider putting a down payment on an option exercise. I honestly don;t know where things stand at present.

 

[PRR 60]

They first need to figure out how exxactly to pay for what they have on order. Then if they have some money left they can consider putting a down payment on an option exercise. I honestly don;t know where things stand at present.

That is a minor detail, isn't it. Stretching out the delivery schedule helped with the cash flow crunch. How fortunate they found that design flaw that shut down production for several months.

 

[afigg]

They first need to figure out how exxactly to pay for what they have on order. Then if they have some money left they can consider putting a down payment on an option exercise. I honestly don;t know where things stand at present.

The odds of Amtrak having the funds available to purchase some cars under the 70 car option improved considerably in the wake of the election last week. The uncertainty over what the final FY13 budget amounts will be don't help with planning at all, but even the worse case would have Amtrak continuing to get $1.4 to $1.5 billion a year from Congress. That won't help with a large Amfleet II replacement order, but should be able to cover purchasing an additional 10-30 cars at roughly $2.3 million each through the option if the Amtrak board and upper management think that it is worthwhile to do so.

Reading the more in-depth news reports on the maneuvering and staking out of political positions by the Administration and the many players in Congress, I think the odds are far better than most on here realize of getting more funding for intercity passenger rail and transit projects.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

The problem with adding MORE baggage cars is that I don't think Amtrak runs out of checked baggage space that quickly anyway. They definately need Sleepers more than Baggage Cars. Of the 70 options, I would like to see 35 Sleepers, 10 Diners, and 25 Baggage Cars. Or the same ratio if not all the options are exercised.

I do not think this is unreasonable.