Steaming at the Diner Crew on the 4 (5)

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Here's a question for the smug ear plug crowd...

Why does Amtrak alone require specialized ear plugs when no other first world public transit system seems to have a problem with endless PA interruptions?
Just checked my credentials: no mention of smug ear plug crowd member... but will note that they work just as well on flying cattle-cars, where with screaming 2 year-olds the need seems even greater [also work well for those cellphone users that wish to share their most intimate personal details with me and/or the rest of the world]. ... now back to our regularly scheduled programming :)
 
The inability to turn the PA off while I'm sleeping has me seriously reconsidering using Amtrak for LD trips. I am not even joking.

On the old Superliners, our SCA would tell us to leave it on channel 2 or 3 or whatever to hear the PA and then switch it when we wanted silence. Why couldn't they make (for example) channel 2 be the dining car, cafe car, station stop, SCA "hey, check out the scenery" channel and channel 3 the emergency channel? That way, at night, I could switch over to channel 3 so we didn't miss something emergent.

Or, as another poster mentioned, have some kind of override.

I know I can't be the only person who hates being awakened at 6:30 AM. When you factor time zones into consideration, I really feel for all of the people coming from the west.
Honestly, Amtrak should probably be hit with comments to this effect. There's only so much I can say in good faith, but I'm going to be getting more vocal about this sort of thing in the future.

As to the scenery announcements, I'd be up for limiting those to the SSL (and possibly coaches). Not to put too fine a point on it, but I've covered the Chief through FLG, the Cap from end to end, the Zephyr through OSC, and the Silvers through DLD more times than I can really count. I'm getting there fast with the Adirondack, too. On some of those routes, I could give the spiels...and if I board at 0600 at FLG, I may want to just sleep until ABQ due to a lack of sleep the night before. It happens!
 
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In response to Devil's Advocate (quote is no longer working from IE) I certainly do use ear plugs on airplanes, even in first class. Not always of course, but they're a regular part of my survivalist kit. Two months ago, on #7, I encountered my first sleeper with no PA system control. Usually I pack duct tape and a swiss army knife, but this time I forgot both . Never again. The roomette door rattled something awful (solved easily by stuffing a towel between door and wall). But the PA system was driving me nuts, despite the fact that "cabin crew" did observe the 10-7 quiet hour. With screw driver it will take about 2 minutes to just disconnect the leads to the speaker in your room. As for safety announcements, I'm confident that I'll either hear them via the hall speakers or get awakened in time by all the passengers talking out in the hall way. Just my 2cts worth on a topic I consider quite important.
 
A very impassioned topic, to be sure! I would like to perhaps consolodate the concerns and see if we can all agree on the following:

1) Amtrak should probably observe the 10-7 rule for all announcements. If a sleeper pax wants to get up by 6 AM to be ready for breakfast by 6:30, then I'm sure the SCA can take care of that.

2) Amtrak should probably update their equipment (yeah - $$$). Have a speaker system in the private rooms that allow for ALL announcements (even between 7 am and 10 pm) with the exception of emergencies to be turned off. A switch in the PA system used by the crew would determine whether the announcement was an emergency or not. Return to using channels in the rooms, like the airlines. Maybe not 10 different Muzak channels, as just about everyone has a walkman now, but channel 1 for Scanner, channel 2 for rails & trails, etc. All overridden by any PA announcment. Add a volume control. Maybe emergency announcements should be made to the hallway speakers at a loud volume, so that the volume control in the room had relevancy.

3) Amtrak employees shouldn't go rogue. Stick to the script. Though it may be cute to some folks and maybe even enticing and revenue enhancing, the ill-will towards those who reject the call should trump the former.

4) Passengers should never NEED earplugs. But when they are used, the PA system shouldn't be so obnoxious that the earplugs are rendered useless.
 
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Can you imagine the following announcement made throughout a hotel at 6:30am?Good morning, this is your restaurant maître d'. At this time I would like announce that the restaurant is open and ready for breakfast service. The restaurant is located off the lobby next to the Bimbo Lounge and Sports Bar. Once again, welcome to the hotel.

There could be a riot.
Since we're comparing. Can you imagine the wait staff in that restaurant making $28 per hour plus tips?
Just curious. Have you ever worked in the hospitality industry? Waited tables, tended bar, washed dishes in a restaurant?
 
In response to Devil's Advocate (quote is no longer working from IE) I certainly do use ear plugs on airplanes, even in first class. Not always of course, but they're a regular part of my survivalist kit. Two months ago, on #7, I encountered my first sleeper with no PA system control. Usually I pack duct tape and a swiss army knife, but this time I forgot both . Never again. The roomette door rattled something awful (solved easily by stuffing a towel between door and wall). But the PA system was driving me nuts, despite the fact that "cabin crew" did observe the 10-7 quiet hour. With screw driver it will take about 2 minutes to just disconnect the leads to the speaker in your room. As for safety announcements, I'm confident that I'll either hear them via the hall speakers or get awakened in time by all the passengers talking out in the hall way. Just my 2cts worth on a topic I consider quite important.
You know, considering how many non-functional speakers have come up over the years, I can't help but wonder how much time has been spent reactivating speakers that passengers disabled out of frustration.
 
In response to Devil's Advocate (quote is no longer working from IE) I certainly do use ear plugs on airplanes, even in first class. Not always of course, but they're a regular part of my survivalist kit. Two months ago, on #7, I encountered my first sleeper with no PA system control. Usually I pack duct tape and a swiss army knife, but this time I forgot both . Never again. The roomette door rattled something awful (solved easily by stuffing a towel between door and wall). But the PA system was driving me nuts, despite the fact that "cabin crew" did observe the 10-7 quiet hour. With screw driver it will take about 2 minutes to just disconnect the leads to the speaker in your room. As for safety announcements, I'm confident that I'll either hear them via the hall speakers or get awakened in time by all the passengers talking out in the hall way. Just my 2cts worth on a topic I consider quite important.
Have to grin: clearly gorilla passenger tactics... but wonder if one mightn't do them a favor and instead of disconnecting the speaker, one installs a switch or a pot in series with the speaker, that way future passengers can just throw the switch or turn the volume up or down per their liking ;-) Though I suspect there's some legal beagle thinking "destruction of government property" and citing some piece of the USC. Anyone have a picture of one of these offending speakers, ie, might there actually be room for AMTRAK to install a volume control or on/off switch?
 
These are the ones that I use, mine are yellow, but the same type. They cut out noise so much that I wake up startled when I don't hear anything, thinking something is wrong. LOL but I sleep so much better with them on the train.
Have to agree with them working well... and, maybe too well: had a conductor tell me such on a CZ run to LNK - I guess generally for most sleeping passengers that are getting off at middle-of-the-night stops, all they have to do is talk to them to wake them up/tell them that their stop is coming up in 10 minutes... but with the ear plugs, and especially when I'm soundly asleep, this conductor said that he had to poke me so much that he was afraid I was dead (other than the fact that I was snoring) ;-) ;-( and have to agree with those first moments of wakefulness where one see lips moving but doesn't hear anything - a bit disconcerting :)
 
Looks like there's nothing to complain about on the timing.
If paying customers don't want to be awoken at 6:30AM to hear the same generic breakfast menu each morning why should they be dissuaded from saying so? Simple because their concerns are not shared by a rule book that's already ignored in numerous cases? I believe customers who are concerned about this should call it in and let Amtrak decide if the rule book should be modified to allow for fewer interruptions and more quiet time. Amtrak has taken pains to show they're listening to rider feedback, at least with regard to the AGR rules, so why not take advantage of that option?
My point (which I could have made better) is that it changes the nature of the complaint. You can't complain that the OBS didn't follow a non-existent rule (or didn't break a rule in a way that you prefer). You can complain that they didn't follow the rules on the script and provide feedback that there should be less announcements. My intent certainly wasn't to dissuade anyone from complaining.

With screw driver it will take about 2 minutes to just disconnect the leads to the speaker in your room.
Hopefully you fix the damage before you leave the room for the next person that may want to hear the announcements.
 
I solved the problem of being waken by people in the hall, train whistle, announcements, etc. It wasn't easy and it took a long time - many years. I became hard of hearing. Has so many advantages when you can take your "ears" off. Everything from not being bothered by loud noises to telling your wife you never heard her say "Honey, I need you to ...". The latter is just awesome until she hits you on the head.

Other than the occasional headache from being struck, there are a few disadvantages. You miss hearing the fire engine coming at you from behind, the chirp of a bird, the strange noise in your car and you can't understand what your 3 year old grandchild is telling you but that's the price you pay.

So be thankful you are awaken by the sounds of the crew and the PA system. The alternative is not so good either.
 
I solved the problem of being waken by people in the hall, train whistle, announcements, etc. It wasn't easy and it took a long time - many years. I became hard of hearing. Has so many advantages when you can take your "ears" off. Everything from not being bothered by loud noises to telling your wife you never heard her say "Honey, I need you to ...". The latter is just awesome until she hits you on the head.

Other than the occasional headache from being struck, there are a few disadvantages. You miss hearing the fire engine coming at you from behind, the chirp of a bird, the strange noise in your car and you can't understand what your 3 year old grandchild is telling you but that's the price you pay.

So be thankful you are awaken by the sounds of the crew and the PA system. The alternative is not so good either.
Ditto :)
 
Just be profoundly deaf like me and this issue will never raise its annoying head.
 
As you can see, some of us don't need the quiet car. We just pop out our HAs and enjoy the silence (until the t[SIZE=10.5pt]innitus [/SIZE]gets really bad :( ). ;)
 
Those crazy hearing people are amazing, aren't they, AmtrakBlue? They don't know when they've got it good.
 
Old Cheerleader Yell: "We're from _________ and No-one Could Be Prouder! And If You Cannot Hear Us We'll Yell a Little Louder!"

I have Hearing Loss in One Ear so a Set of Ear Plugs Lasts a Long Time! :lol:
 
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A very impassioned topic, to be sure! I would like to perhaps consolodate the concerns and see if we can all agree on the following:

1) Amtrak should probably observe the 10-7 rule for all announcements. If a sleeper pax wants to get up by 6 AM to be ready for breakfast by 6:30, then I'm sure the SCA can take care of that.

2) Amtrak should probably update their equipment (yeah - $$$). Have a speaker system in the private rooms that allow for ALL announcements (even between 7 am and 10 pm) with the exception of emergencies to be turned off. A switch in the PA system used by the crew would determine whether the announcement was an emergency or not. Return to using channels in the rooms, like the airlines. Maybe not 10 different Muzak channels, as just about everyone has a walkman now, but channel 1 for Scanner, channel 2 for rails & trails, etc. All overridden by any PA announcment. Add a volume control. Maybe emergency announcements should be made to the hallway speakers at a loud volume, so that the volume control in the room had relevancy.

3) Amtrak employees shouldn't go rogue. Stick to the script. Though it may be cute to some folks and maybe even enticing and revenue enhancing, the ill-will towards those who reject the call should trump the former.

4) Passengers should never NEED earplugs. But when they are used, the PA system shouldn't be so obnoxious that the earplugs are rendered useless.
I agree with all of this. Absolutely. Emergency announcments can come through the hallway loud; it should be possible to turn everything else off in your room; apart from emergencies, the 7 - 10 rule should be followed; and employees should stick to the script for reasons of keeping the announcements SHORT. (I'm not going to complain about tiny changes in wording, it's the entire extra paragraphs which are the problem.)
 
Or Amtrak could learn to not have quite as many announcements, and have them fairly standardized. Personally, the problem doesn't seem to be the fact that there are announcements, but there's so many unnecessary announcements.

If they had enforced quiet times between 10 PM and 7 AM local time (so no announcements other than emergencies) and standardized, simple announcements when needed (instead of overly chatty car attendants at times) it would help tremendously.
This.
 
First, what is the "Smug earplug crowd?" Sounds like one of those exclusive groups I'm happy to be excluded from. Anyway in response to why Amtrak is the "ONLY" mode of transit where earplugs are required..... this can only be asserted by someone who has never been jarred awake from a cherished nap to hear a bored Captain or First Officer pick up the mic with "AND...UHHHHH LADIES AND GENTLEMEN FOR THOSE OF YOU ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE AIRCRAFT YOU WILL NOW SEE......" My theory is this variety of announcement was only made on flights where I actually did fall asleep.

Going back to the LD train announcements, consider this. You're in charge, you make the rules. Assume that half of your passengers are more likely to be upset if you make announcements... and the other half are the opposite, they will be upset if you don't make announcements, particularly for the breakfast service. So what do you do? Would you rather get complaints for making the announcements.... or not making them? If you don't make announcements, people will have legitimate, compensable claims that service wasn't provided, information wasn't given, etc. If you do make announcements you risk annoying some people, but they won't be able to claim you didn't make the announcements.
 
Assume that half of your passengers are more likely to be upset if you make announcements... and the other half are the opposite, they will be upset if you don't make announcements, particularly for the breakfast service. So what do you do? Would you rather get complaints for making the announcements.... or not making them? If you don't make announcements, people will have legitimate, compensable claims that service wasn't provided, information wasn't given, etc. If you do make announcements you risk annoying some people, but they won't be able to claim you didn't make the announcements.
I don't care about the announcements themselves. They can prattle on about pizza, beer, scrambled eggs, and the hokey pokey for all I care, but I want the option to shut that nonsense off until I wake up.

I used 37db earplugs along with sound-muffling (not canceling) headphones on our last trip, and I still woke up when the cafe car opened for breakfast and when the SCA blathered on about Kansas City for a good five minutes. That is why I want the option to turn it off/down or switch channels like I used to.

When I traveled in the transdorm, I didn't hear the PA at all. Someone told me the PA is shut off in the transdorm. If that's the case, then I'll make sure to book a room in there from now on. It's a decent compromise, especially since I liked the transdorm.
 
Can you imagine the following announcement made throughout a hotel at 6:30am?

Good morning, this is your restaurant maître d'. At this time I would like announce that the restaurant is open and ready for breakfast service. The restaurant is located off the lobby next to the Bimbo Lounge and Sports Bar. Once again, welcome to the hotel.

There could be a riot.
This. Exactly. There is an announcement before quiet hours that the dining car opens for breakfast at 6:00 AM. They don't need a second one reminding people. If they're up, they'll find their way to the coffee. If they're not, let them sleep.
 
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