TSA @ Chicago Union Station - July 5, 2012

[GoldenSpike]

An unhappy passenger at CUS shot some footage of what appears to be a TSA

Kabuki Theater Security VIPR team setting up a random checkpoint for departing

AMTRAK passengers.



IIRC, the Amtrak Police chief threw the bums out in the past for this. But it seems

he has retired and the new chief is all for it.

 

[Eric S]

Nothing new there. TSA has set up at Chicago Union Station many times. And, Amtrak Police were present, which I believe is the restriction Amtrak had placed on TSA, not a complete ban.

 

[john h]

Maybe there was a threat that we do not know about

 

[stntylr]

There are TSA agents at Union Station!!

There are TSA agents at Union Station!!

There are TSA agents at Union Station!!

If you watched the video you get the joke.

 

[amtrakwolverine]

didn't the TSA give amtrak a gold medal for security. Why do they need to be involved?

 

[RRUserious]

Hate to be the wet blanket, but with the mass confusion that is Union Station, that COULD be a target for an attack. People just walk in from the street, and there's nothing to restrict movement anywhere. I don't WANT TSA anywhere, but someday there's gonna be an "event" and then movement will be greatly curtailed.

If, that is, you believe there is actually any longer any threat. I have to admit I'm dubious. But I was totally caught by surprise in 2001. I really thought they had matters under control back then.

 

[Eric S]

Hate to be the wet blanket, but with the mass confusion that is Union Station, that COULD be a target for an attack. People just walk in from the street, and there's nothing to restrict movement anywhere. I don't WANT TSA anywhere, but someday there's gonna be an "event" and then movement will be greatly curtailed.

If, that is, you believe there is actually any longer any threat. I have to admit I'm dubious. But I was totally caught by surprise in 2001. I really thought they had matters under control back then.

How is that all that different from other major stations?

 

[Grandpa D]

I saw the TSA there about 10 months ago. They set up just like that guy was recording. Only difference was it was at the north gates, 19 IIRC.

 

[TVRM610]

Was this for full body searches? Or baggage checks?

 

[Eric S]

When I have seen TSA in CHI in recent months, they have been selecting every nth (5th, 10th, whatever it is) passenger for baggage checks.

 

[chrsjrcj]

1341965040[/url]' post='379338']

1341962061[/url]' post='379330']Hate to be the wet blanket, but with the mass confusion that is Union Station, that COULD be a target for an attack. People just walk in from the street, and there's nothing to restrict movement anywhere. I don't WANT TSA anywhere, but someday there's gonna be an "event" and then movement will be greatly curtailed.

If, that is, you believe there is actually any longer any threat. I have to admit I'm dubious. But I was totally caught by surprise in 2001. I really thought they had matters under control back then.

How is that all that different from other major stations?

How is it different from any place in the world? Might as well make people go through a security check point the second they exit their house.

 

[chrsjrcj]

1341967375[/url]' post='379342']When I have seen TSA in CHI in recent months, they have been selecting every nth (5th, 10th, whatever it is) passenger for baggage checks.

I'm curious to know if they actually go through the baggage, or is it an x-ray screening?

 

[AutoTrDvr]

When I have seen TSA in CHI in recent months, they have been selecting every nth (5th, 10th, whatever it is) passenger for baggage checks.

I'm curious to know if they actually go through the baggage, or is it an x-ray screening?

Unless they can bring in portable X-Ray scanners, or they keep a set on hand at Union Station, I'm thinking they are hand inspecting.

If they start doing it on the AT, I think it will lose a lot of customers, who will just go back to driving the distance.

 

[Anderson]

I don't think there's anything that I haven't said already that needs saying as far as my opinion of the TSA. The biggest problem with a lot of major stations, though, is that the volume of traffic there is enough to at least inhibit security. To ask a practical question, how do you run scans at rush hour in Penn Station or Grand Central (or along the New York subway)? You really can't, at least at peak travel times, without creating such a mess that if anything I would expect the backed-up lines to be a terrorist target themselves.

 

[RRUserious]

After bombs were planted on trains in Mumbai, India, I read discussions of what should the police do. And the consensus seemed to be they were faced with huge difficulty just because so many people ride the commuter trains. They did do something, but not in the same galaxy as TSA in airports. I still think travelers' eyes are the biggest asset, if they look for danger signs. I was in the Great Hall of Union Station, with two or three of my rechargeable things plugged in. I went to sit on a wooden bench and watched my things because I thought someone might summon station security, not knowing the owner was watching from a few feet away. Eventually, I just went to be by them. Didn't want to spook anyone.

 

[PRR 60]

Amtrak Police and TSA conduct random screenings regularly at PHL. Besides some visual inspection, they use this hand-held device:

Smiths Detection

The process seems pretty quick and non-intrusive. I've never seen it cause a back-up. I would expect the process at CHI is the same.

 

[AutoTrDvr]

Amtrak Police and TSA conduct random screenings regularly at PHL. Besides some visual inspection, they use this hand-held device:

Smiths Detection

The process seems pretty quick and non-intrusive. I've never seen it cause a back-up. I would expect the process at CHI is the same.

I wouldn't have a problem with this, as I didn't have a problem with the Amtrak Police K-9 unit at LOR. Sniff all you want. If you alert on me

or mine, then we'll see how it goes. But for Amtrak, it's not like I'm going to lose "overhead space" as with an aircraft. I can board the train whenever I want.

The problem is when the TSA wants to start fiddling with your gadgets to see how they work. I carry on my diving gear with me including my regulators, dive computers etc. When flying, the TSA had this nasty little habit of tinkering with the gear to see how it works, often putting it at risk of serious damage. And when you ask (as politely as possible) "Can I show you how to operate that," you often get the evil eye from them.

I would hope that the TSA (especially those that work near water/beach destinations) receive a little "in-service" training on diving gear.

It would be fine if all they did was swab the pieces in question and run the swabs through their chemical analysis machine. But some of these people just have to tinker. :angry:

 

[Joeker]

Oh Great. I take the train because I don't have to go thru this Kabuki Theater that is the TSA at the airport, now this. What next TSA on Megabus?

I guess I will stick to driving.

 

[cirdan]

Hate to be the wet blanket, but with the mass confusion that is Union Station, that COULD be a target for an attack. People just walk in from the street, and there's nothing to restrict movement anywhere. I don't WANT TSA anywhere, but someday there's gonna be an "event" and then movement will be greatly curtailed..

If you prevent the free circulation of people and cause massive congesion and long queues concentrating a lot of people into a restricted space, you are making it easier for terrorists to kill a lot of people. Such checks are part of the problem and not part of the solution.

 

[chrsjrcj]

1342015485[/url]' post='379411']Oh Great. I take the train because I don't have to go thru this Kabuki Theater that is the TSA at the airport, now this. What next TSA on Megabus?

I guess I will stick to driving.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoF6eLPwd0c

 

[PRR 60]

Oh Great. I take the train because I don't have to go thru this Kabuki Theater that is the TSA at the airport, now this. What next TSA on Megabus?

I guess I will stick to driving.

So, that's how little you actually like rail travel? You only ride Amtrak to avoid the TSA at the airport, and now the remote possibility of a 30-second screening is enough to forget Amtrak and drive. Perhaps the "theater" is not limited to the TSA.

 

[the_traveler]

I was at MKA (the airport train station) I think a couple of years ago. TSA from the airport came to the train station to check everyone's bag. They did a quick non-intrusive check of the bags and did a swab to check for explosive residue on the bags.

As I was going north to MKE, and there was an earlier train arriving headed south to CHI, I know they were only checking those headed south. When the southbound train arrived, they packed up their tables and equipment and left.

I have also been at PHL for #66 when they set up a table to do random checks of passengers. Out of the 50-60 people in line, they checked 1 person! Again it was quick and painless.

These are the kinds of "Security" checks I can live with - not the airport "Security Theater"!

 

[Ispolkom]

I was at MKA (the airport train station) I think a couple of years ago. TSA from the airport came to the train station to check everyone's bag. They did a quick non-intrusive check of the bags and did a swab to check for explosive residue on the bags.

As I was going north to MKE, and there was an earlier train arriving headed south to CHI, I know they were only checking those headed south. When the southbound train arrived, they packed up their tables and equipment and left.

I have also been at PHL for #66 when they set up a table to do random checks of passengers. Out of the 50-60 people in line, they checked 1 person! Again it was quick and painless.

These are the kinds of "Security" checks I can live with - not the airport "Security Theater"!

I'd disagree. While the search you describe is perhaps less objectionable than others, it's still pointless security theater. Who's going to bring a bomb on a Hiawatha when you can run a truck bomb into it at a grade crossing? Aren't there a bunch of grade crossings just north of Chicago Union Station? Don't nonterrorist drivers ram trains on a daily basis at grade crossings across this great country of ours?

 

[the_traveler]

1342025972[/url]' post='379450']Who's going to bring a bomb on a Hiawatha when you can run a truck bomb into it at a grade crossing? Aren't there a bunch of grade crossings just north of Chicago Union Station? Don't nonterrorist drivers ram trains on a daily basis at grade crossings across this great country of ours?

We all know those people north of Chicago are terrorist!

And drivers don't ram trains. The train didn't swerve out of the way or stop in time!

 

[PRR 60]

I was at MKA (the airport train station) I think a couple of years ago. TSA from the airport came to the train station to check everyone's bag. They did a quick non-intrusive check of the bags and did a swab to check for explosive residue on the bags.

As I was going north to MKE, and there was an earlier train arriving headed south to CHI, I know they were only checking those headed south. When the southbound train arrived, they packed up their tables and equipment and left.

I have also been at PHL for #66 when they set up a table to do random checks of passengers. Out of the 50-60 people in line, they checked 1 person! Again it was quick and painless.

These are the kinds of "Security" checks I can live with - not the airport "Security Theater"!

I'd disagree. While the search you describe is perhaps less objectionable than others, it's still pointless security theater. Who's going to bring a bomb on a Hiawatha when you can run a truck bomb into it at a grade crossing? Aren't there a bunch of grade crossings just north of Chicago Union Station? Don't nonterrorist drivers ram trains on a daily basis at grade crossings across this great country of ours?

I think you are answering a different question: is there a security value to the random Amtrak screening by TSA and Amtrak Police? Saying that the screenings are a total waste of resources with zero benefit is a perfectly valid position. That is security policy issue that is way above Amtrak. However, if the question is whether the limited screenings presently taking pace are an actual inconvenience to Amtrak passengers, then from my observation, I can't see how they are. Only a very small percentage of Amtrak passengers are subject to any screening. Those who are subject to it are detained less than a minute, and that is it. No long lines, no body scans, nothing remotely approaching airport security. From a passenger perspective, it is virtually a non-event.

So, is it a waste of time? Could well be. It is a problem that adversely impacts the enjoyment of Amtrak travel? The way it is being conducted today, I can't see that at all.